Break in!
Re: Break in!
So sorry, Ron. Glad you're ok!
When someone tried to break into our house, it was also in the middle of the day. Since I work from home, we installed an alarm system *AND* motion sensors to the front and back door areas. They aren't tied to the alarm, but they set-off a chime inside the house if anyone approaches either door. It's great peace of mind when I'm home alone!!
When someone tried to break into our house, it was also in the middle of the day. Since I work from home, we installed an alarm system *AND* motion sensors to the front and back door areas. They aren't tied to the alarm, but they set-off a chime inside the house if anyone approaches either door. It's great peace of mind when I'm home alone!!
Kelly
- SeanKylgod
- Compulsive Diver
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Re: Break in!
Glad to see another person who isn't all sprung solely on just the mossberg 500/590's and can think of an old relic as more than a "boxy auto-loading piece of aluminum" =P
That's awesome to hear that you were also LE at one point. I base my knowledge of castle clause stuff on Atlanta's castle clause rules which essentially state that you are entitled to do whatever necessary to stop someone's forced entry into your "castle" (be it car or home) where you feel that "upon them entering they pose immediate threat of death or dismemberment." One would assume the tool used to pry your window open and break your door frame could be used in a lethal way. A crowbar is definitely a lethal weapon IMO. I would have persuaded the person to leave verbally AFTER calling 911 and staying on the line for recorded confirmation that I gave three stern verbal warnings, then and only then would I have used any force.
as always, it's easier said when it's not happening to you. As a legal, law abiding and heavily armed citizen, I have always stood by the fact anyone who takes the massive responsibility of carrying/possessing firearms should also fully understand the legal ramifications of doing so and also the position you have put yourself in when you have decided that you, as an individual have good enough judgment on the fly to make a well informed decision that could essentially save a yours or a loved one's life.. or also potentially destroy it.
It's hard to have much verbal leverage on such topics as people can't look past metal in one's face or the hair on their head. I take extra care to deep conceal when I carry simply for the fact that if I were 40 year old John Smith in Safeway buying groceries for the family and I saw someone who looks like me with a Kimber printing on the small of his back I wouldnt think to myself "Oh, that guy is probably just a CCW holder.. no biggie" I would definitely think "this kid has a gun, I'm calling the cops."
I can speak to that in a truth where I printed while bending over to grab a 50 pound bag of dog food and got kicked to the ground by a "concerned father".
[/Rant]
That's awesome to hear that you were also LE at one point. I base my knowledge of castle clause stuff on Atlanta's castle clause rules which essentially state that you are entitled to do whatever necessary to stop someone's forced entry into your "castle" (be it car or home) where you feel that "upon them entering they pose immediate threat of death or dismemberment." One would assume the tool used to pry your window open and break your door frame could be used in a lethal way. A crowbar is definitely a lethal weapon IMO. I would have persuaded the person to leave verbally AFTER calling 911 and staying on the line for recorded confirmation that I gave three stern verbal warnings, then and only then would I have used any force.
as always, it's easier said when it's not happening to you. As a legal, law abiding and heavily armed citizen, I have always stood by the fact anyone who takes the massive responsibility of carrying/possessing firearms should also fully understand the legal ramifications of doing so and also the position you have put yourself in when you have decided that you, as an individual have good enough judgment on the fly to make a well informed decision that could essentially save a yours or a loved one's life.. or also potentially destroy it.
It's hard to have much verbal leverage on such topics as people can't look past metal in one's face or the hair on their head. I take extra care to deep conceal when I carry simply for the fact that if I were 40 year old John Smith in Safeway buying groceries for the family and I saw someone who looks like me with a Kimber printing on the small of his back I wouldnt think to myself "Oh, that guy is probably just a CCW holder.. no biggie" I would definitely think "this kid has a gun, I'm calling the cops."
I can speak to that in a truth where I printed while bending over to grab a 50 pound bag of dog food and got kicked to the ground by a "concerned father".
[/Rant]
cardiver wrote:We like the same firearms! I fell in love with the Spas 12 at the FBI Academy SWAT school back in 1986 and switched from a 1911 Gold Cup to a Glock in 1989.....Jeff Pack wrote:You are right as for Castle Clause, but you are wrong in how its acknowledged. Just reaching in is not grounds for use of deadly force under the Castle Doctrine. I wont go into the details, its public searchable. Every gun owner should understand it, and realize that Wa state is not your friend in the enforcement of it.SeanKylgod wrote:this IS a castle clause state.. my 10mm G20 would have been outta the question as my EDC is my .40cal G23 and my Glock 20 is next to my Sig on my night-stand.. two feet from my PS90 and Spas 12 ;-)cardiver wrote:What I should have done is let him gain entry and then double tap him with 10mm's........Jeff Pack wrote:Too bad you didnt catch him.
Its a problem easily solved with 50pds of lime and shovel
But for a no worries, problem taken care of, the lime and shovel avoids the legal stuff entirely.
(and future law suits, etc).
I keep trying to explain to friends that using deadly force in the situation that I had would not be justified. If he had gained entry I would have put him down but as it was he just broke the door......
.
Re: Break in!
You got some kind of Dexter thing going there, Jeff????Jeff Pack wrote:Too bad you didnt catch him.
Its a problem easily solved with 50pds of lime and shovel
Dave
"Clearly, you weren't listening to what I'm about to say."
--
Check out my Internet show:
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"Clearly, you weren't listening to what I'm about to say."
--
Check out my Internet show:
http://www.irvingszoo.com
Re: Break in!
Funny, but in a sort of way, I was back in those days depending how you looked at what I did back then.dwashbur wrote:You got some kind of Dexter thing going there, Jeff????Jeff Pack wrote:Too bad you didnt catch him.
Its a problem easily solved with 50pds of lime and shovel
But as for today, the legal ramifications of using a weapon are so vast, I find myself falling back into that old adage
"dead men tell no tales". Because nowadays, even if you were 100% justified, you'll wind up with a victims family, many times the government, all legally after you.
But if the bad person just disappears... well, too bad, so sad. Problem solved.
=============================================
- I got a good squirt in my mouth
- I would imagine that there would be a large amount of involuntary gagging
- I don't know about you but I'm not into swallowing it
CCR discussion on Caustic Cocktails.
- I got a good squirt in my mouth
- I would imagine that there would be a large amount of involuntary gagging
- I don't know about you but I'm not into swallowing it
CCR discussion on Caustic Cocktails.
-
- Aquaphile
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Re: Break in!
They will be testing your Castle theory in La Center,Wa ....homeowner shot and killed a car thief last week.
“From birth, man carries the weight of gravity on his shoulders. He is bolted to earth. But man has only to sink beneath the surface and he is free.”
Re: Break in!
Nice, did you fight back, calmly ask him WTF he was doing, or something in between?SeanKylgod wrote:I can speak to that in a truth where I printed while bending over to grab a 50 pound bag of dog food and got kicked to the ground by a "concerned father".
Sorry about your door Ron, was this in Enumclaw during the day?
Sounder wrote:Under normal circumstances, I would never tell another man how to shave his balls... but this device should not be kept secret.
- SeanKylgod
- Compulsive Diver
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- Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2012 10:24 pm
Re: Break in!
when I fell, I tried grabbing out for balance and managed to grab hold of one of the pooper scoopers that was hanging from the shelf on display.. I openly admit that once I landed I chucked it at his head and called him a few choice words.. haha. He had already called the cops so once they got there, they asked what happened, asked the guy if I was brandishing my weapon or if my shirt just slid up like I had said. He told the truth and the cop asked if I wanted to press charges for him kicking me. I said no, "the rest of the A-Team will miss his heroic actions". the cop giggle-snorted and I left.
CaptnJack wrote:Nice, did you fight back, calmly ask him WTF he was doing, or something in between?SeanKylgod wrote:I can speak to that in a truth where I printed while bending over to grab a 50 pound bag of dog food and got kicked to the ground by a "concerned father".
Sorry about your door Ron, was this in Enumclaw during the day?
.
Re: Break in!
Yep. Happened at 1345 while I was sitting in my office doing some work. Door bell rang and I didn't answer it because the only people door knocking during the day are selling vacuums or religion. Neither of which I'm interested in. AFter he rang the bell he knocked really hard on the door and then silence. A couple of minutes later the side door in my garage was being kicked in.....
-Ron T.
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
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"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
Re: Break in!
Ahhh so its your fault for not barking like a pit bull!cardiver wrote:Yep. Happened at 1345 while I was sitting in my office doing some work. Door bell rang and I didn't answer it because the only people door knocking during the day are selling vacuums or religion. Neither of which I'm interested in. AFter he rang the bell he knocked really hard on the door and then silence. A couple of minutes later the side door in my garage was being kicked in.....
Sounder wrote:Under normal circumstances, I would never tell another man how to shave his balls... but this device should not be kept secret.
Re: Break in!
Yep......
-Ron T.
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
Re: Break in!
You know instead of fantasizing about killing the kid who tried to do this, you could have cameras covering your doorways and windows and that would both be a deterrent, and since the kid is probably known to law enforcement if you got a good enough pic of him they could do something about it. If nothing was stolen and it was only damage to the doorframe its likely not going to provide a lot of legal satisfaction for you, but had you actually not been home -- and therefore not able to unload your home arsenal in his general direction -- you'd be able to get him for a felony if he took off with enough expensive gear (including the aforementioned home arsenal) and you'd stand a chance of recovering the stolen items.
For bonus points set up some kind of motion detection system that pages you so that if you're at work you can monitor your cameras remotely and send the cops to your home if there is a break-in actually in progress and then they can arrest the guys (and take care of the trained use of lethal force if necessary for you).
For bonus points set up some kind of motion detection system that pages you so that if you're at work you can monitor your cameras remotely and send the cops to your home if there is a break-in actually in progress and then they can arrest the guys (and take care of the trained use of lethal force if necessary for you).
Re: Break in!
+1lamont wrote:You know...
"The place looked like a washing machine full of Josh's carharts. I was not into it." --Sockmonkey
Re: Break in!
airsix wrote:+1lamont wrote:You know...
-Ron T.
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
Re: Break in!
airsix wrote:+1lamont wrote:You know...
You know... if for whatever reason you felt you needed to shoot him, why couldn't you have just shot him in the leg or something?
GUE Seattle - The official GUE Affiliate in the Northwest!
Re: Break in!
I don't think that I could even aim at a leg! Every bit of training I've ever had with a firearm was a double tap, center mass........ Or one shot to the obdulla oblongata.Sounder wrote:airsix wrote:+1lamont wrote:You know...
You know... if for whatever reason you felt you needed to shoot him, why couldn't you have just shot him in the leg or something?
-Ron T.
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
Re: Break in!
What about just doing a warning shot to teach him a lesson?cardiver wrote:I don't think that I could even aim at a leg! Every bit of training I've ever had with a firearm was a double tap, center mass........ Or one shot to the obdulla oblongata.Sounder wrote:airsix wrote:+1lamont wrote:You know...
You know... if for whatever reason you felt you needed to shoot him, why couldn't you have just shot him in the leg or something?
GUE Seattle - The official GUE Affiliate in the Northwest!
Re: Break in!
Doug, it's a good thing I know you so well. You forgot to use the sarcasm font.
"The place looked like a washing machine full of Josh's carharts. I was not into it." --Sockmonkey
Re: Break in!
Well, you know...airsix wrote:Doug, it's a good thing I know you so well. You forgot to use the sarcasm font.
GUE Seattle - The official GUE Affiliate in the Northwest!
Re: Break in!
I'm glad you are okay Ron and you don't have to deal with all of the other legal stuff that goes along with the double tap thing.
This guy had no idea how lucky he was.
I wouldn't mess with you, or your house!
This guy had no idea how lucky he was.
I wouldn't mess with you, or your house!
Hi, my name is Keith, and I'm a Dive Addict!
Re: Break in!
Forget the legal stuff. I would take a life to save a potential victim (self or others) from potentially deadly assault, but it would probably destroy me emotionally. I'm glad the perp didn't put Ron in a situation to bear that burden.
"The place looked like a washing machine full of Josh's carharts. I was not into it." --Sockmonkey
Re: Break in!
:luv:airsix wrote:Forget the legal stuff. I would take a life to save a potential victim (self or others) from potentially deadly assault, but it would probably destroy me emotionally. I'm glad the perp didn't put Ron in a situation to bear that burden.
Sounder wrote:Under normal circumstances, I would never tell another man how to shave his balls... but this device should not be kept secret.
Re: Break in!
So is Ron......... I'm fine with him seeing me and fleeing the scene.CaptnJack wrote::luv:airsix wrote:Forget the legal stuff. I would take a life to save a potential victim (self or others) from potentially deadly assault, but it would probably destroy me emotionally. I'm glad the perp didn't put Ron in a situation to bear that burden.
I just hope that the knucklehead has some common sense and doesn't try again.
-Ron T.
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
Re: Break in!
Well if anything the ole "Dude, when breaking into a house, first ring the doorbell, then knock, and then knock LOUDLY, and if noone answers then you are clear to enter and steal." philosophy has been shot to hell. He can pass that onto his thieving homies.
**Pinch it, don't stick your finger through. You're just pinching a bigger hole.
CAPTNJACK - 2012**
CAPTNJACK - 2012**
Re: Break in!
Definitely! I really wish I could have seen the look of surprise on his face when I came flying out into my garage.Norris wrote:Well if anything the ole "Dude, when breaking into a house, first ring the doorbell, then knock, and then knock LOUDLY, and if noone answers then you are clear to enter and steal." philosophy has been shot to hell. He can pass that onto his thieving homies.
-Ron T.
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
"When I'm 80 I'll take up real diving, which is done in a pub..." Ray Ives.
253-227-0856
My Dive Pics...
https://www.facebook.com/RETOPPPHOTOGRAPHY
Re: Break in!
Well I dont know about you but as the guy was forcing his way into the garage HE accidently discharged the SPEAR GUN for which was hanging next to the door.
Just glad to hear that you and your kids are OK and maybe your next purchase should be a security camera. At least you would have pictures of the vehicle and guy for the police. I keep putting getting one off myself but this seems to make it a wise choice. That and hand gun ownership
Just glad to hear that you and your kids are OK and maybe your next purchase should be a security camera. At least you would have pictures of the vehicle and guy for the police. I keep putting getting one off myself but this seems to make it a wise choice. That and hand gun ownership
Jeff Castor