DAN might not be what you think it is...

[Mattleycrue76]

Well I just got off the phone with the insurance claims person at DAN and she had the gall to tell me that my injury was not "dive related". I'm so pissed right now I could throw something through a window.

They should rename their product Hyperbaric Chamber Insurance since apparently that's all it's good for.

Once I cool of a little I'm gonna write a detailed report of what happened, and how it was handled and post it on every forum I can sign up for. That's what I get for not lying and saying I slipped and fell in th surf zone :angry:

[Mattleycrue76]

This is what their handbook says about it:

Covered Dive means a recreational dive or diving while a scuba instructor, divemaster, underwater
photographer, or while performing research under the auspices and following the diving safety guidelines of the American Academy of Underwater Scientists (AAUS). A dive begins upon entry into the water and ends upon exit from the water. A Covered Dive must begin while Insurance is in force.

Can someone please explain to me how walking from the water to the place you take your gear off is not part of the exit?

[Penopolypants]

That really sucks, I'm so sorry.

I looked through my old stuff this weekend and couldn't find a pre-2010 handbook to see when that changed. Grr....

Edit: You are covered for non-diving injuries if you are out of your home country AND more than 50 miles from home:

Benefits for Accident Medical Expense
Covered Medical Charges
If an Insured Person incurs charges for treatment of Injury due to a non-Diving Accident that occurs
outside his or her Home Country, United States Life will pay the benefits described below subject to the
terms and limitations.

Covered charges means eligible charges that are for Medically Necessary services, supplies, care, or
treatment for such Injury. The accident must occur while Coverage is in force and while the Insured
Person is on a trip that is more than fifty miles from his or her primary residence and for recreational
purposes only. The charge incurred as a result of the accident must be incurred within 365 days of the
accident.

Such services, supplies, care or treatment must be prescribed, performed or ordered by a Physician and
include medical, surgical, and emergency dental care, professional nursing, hospital, x-ray, ground
ambulance services and prosthetic devices. Charges for such services, supplies, care or treatment must be
Reasonable and Customary. United States Life will not pay for charges in excess of the maximum shown
in the Certificate Schedule.

The preferred plan policy is only 13 pages long, and while it's not a riveting read, it' s useful info:

http://www.diversalertnetwork.org/insur ... edcert.pdf

[lavachickie]

[...]
A dive begins upon entry into the water and ends upon exit from the water. A Covered Dive must begin while Insurance is in force.

That sux; I've heard a few stories about how DAN often covers more than you anticipate. I guess the line has to be drawn somewhere.

When I think of the definition of, "the dive," I think of from gear don to gear doff; clearly, DAN views it as touching water = dive. No touchie water, no dive. That's good to know. I'm sorry you had an incident, but curious to hear the details.

What other coverages might be in play you could use? Private health, personal injury through ??

[airsix]

I'm with Amy. I'm for starting a petition to have DAN expand coverage to include the entry/exit portion of the dive. IMHO if you still have tanks on your back the dive isn't over yet. I'd gladly pay a reasonably higher premium if necessary.

-Ben

[LCF]

This is really weird, because DAN did pay the bills for my broken face, which occurred when climbing the rocks out of Cove 2. They paid slowly and it required several phone calls and the like, but they did pay. And I was NOT in the water when it happened.

[Penopolypants]

This is really weird, because DAN did pay the bills for my broken face, which occurred when climbing the rocks out of Cove 2. They paid slowly and it required several phone calls and the like, but they did pay. And I was NOT in the water when it happened.

When did it happen? Their last update to their handbook was February 2010. Was it before that?

[Norris]

Long before then

[CaptnJack]

The issue may be with the actual insurer (who has a financial incentive to deny claims) not DAN themselves (who merely sell the actual policy). Seems like the definition of "a dive" got tighter.

[LCF]

My accident was April of 2009.

[Mattleycrue76]

Looks like the next step is to write a letter of appeal. Lynne, would it be ok for me to reference your accident?

[Jaksonbrown]

That really sucks, I'm so sorry.

I looked through my old stuff this weekend and couldn't find a pre-2010 handbook to see when that changed. Grr....

Edit: You are covered for non-diving injuries if you are out of your home country AND more than 50 miles from home:

Benefits for Accident Medical Expense
Covered Medical Charges
If an Insured Person incurs charges for treatment of Injury due to a non-Diving Accident that occurs
outside his or her Home Country, United States Life will pay the benefits described below subject to the
terms and limitations.

Covered charges means eligible charges that are for Medically Necessary services, supplies, care, or
treatment for such Injury. The accident must occur while Coverage is in force and while the Insured
Person is on a trip that is more than fifty miles from his or her primary residence and for recreational
purposes only. The charge incurred as a result of the accident must be incurred within 365 days of the
accident.

Such services, supplies, care or treatment must be prescribed, performed or ordered by a Physician and
include medical, surgical, and emergency dental care, professional nursing, hospital, x-ray, ground
ambulance services and prosthetic devices. Charges for such services, supplies, care or treatment must be
Reasonable and Customary. United States Life will not pay for charges in excess of the maximum shown
in the Certificate Schedule.

The preferred plan policy is only 13 pages long, and while it's not a riveting read, it' s useful info:

http://www.diversalertnetwork.org/insur ... edcert.pdf

Matt,... How far is it to Cove 2 from your house?... Ill bet it is more than 50 miles.......

Edit....

Ahh crap... its only about 40 miles guessing where you live by the slough...

[cardiver]

That really sucks, I'm so sorry.

I looked through my old stuff this weekend and couldn't find a pre-2010 handbook to see when that changed. Grr....

Edit: You are covered for non-diving injuries if you are out of your home country AND more than 50 miles from home:

Benefits for Accident Medical Expense
Covered Medical Charges
If an Insured Person incurs charges for treatment of Injury due to a non-Diving Accident that occurs
outside his or her Home Country, United States Life will pay the benefits described below subject to the
terms and limitations.

Covered charges means eligible charges that are for Medically Necessary services, supplies, care, or
treatment for such Injury. The accident must occur while Coverage is in force and while the Insured
Person is on a trip that is more than fifty miles from his or her primary residence and for recreational
purposes only. The charge incurred as a result of the accident must be incurred within 365 days of the
accident.

Such services, supplies, care or treatment must be prescribed, performed or ordered by a Physician and
include medical, surgical, and emergency dental care, professional nursing, hospital, x-ray, ground
ambulance services and prosthetic devices. Charges for such services, supplies, care or treatment must be
Reasonable and Customary. United States Life will not pay for charges in excess of the maximum shown
in the Certificate Schedule.

The preferred plan policy is only 13 pages long, and while it's not a riveting read, it' s useful info:

http://www.diversalertnetwork.org/insur ... edcert.pdf

Matt,... How far is it to Cove 2 from your house?... Ill bet it is more than 50 miles.......

Edit....

Ahh crap... its only about 40 miles guessing where you live by the slough...

It reads, "Out of the country AND more than 50 miles from your home" I'm pretty sure that Matt doesn't live in Canada.....

[rjarnold]

Did you have the preferred plan Matt?

I'm guessing it doesn't matter which plan you have though, a dive, by their definition, remains the same?

[Mattleycrue76]

Did you have the preferred plan Matt?

I'm guessing it doesn't matter which plan you have though, a dive, by their definition, remains the same?

Yes, and yes.

[Penopolypants]

Matt, was your policy renewed before or after February?

If this change happened in February, and your policy was renewed prior to that under the old handbook, you might be able to argue that angle....

[CaptnJack]

Matt, was your policy renewed before or after February?

If this change happened in February, and your policy was renewed prior to that under the old handbook, you might be able to argue that angle....

When did the policy change? 2/2010 or 2/2009

Matt's accident was in Jan 2010.

[Mattleycrue76]

Matt, was your policy renewed before or after February?

If this change happened in February, and your policy was renewed prior to that under the old handbook, you might be able to argue that angle....

When did the policy change? 2/2010 or 2/2009

Matt's accident was in Jan 2010.

Acually it was at noon on Dec 31st.

[Penopolypants]

Matt, was your policy renewed before or after February?

If this change happened in February, and your policy was renewed prior to that under the old handbook, you might be able to argue that angle....

When did the policy change? 2/2010 or 2/2009

Matt's accident was in Jan 2010.

Their online handbook was last updated in February 2010. I don't have previous versions to compare to and verify that this was when the change was made.

If they update their policy once a year in February, and Lynne's accident was covered in April 2009, then it makes sense that the change happened in the last update. If they update multiple times a year then who knows?

[Mattleycrue76]

I suspect that it comes down to the claims department and the specific person handling the case.

[Jaksonbrown]

I suspect that it comes down to the claims department and the specific person handling the case.

Keep fighting bro... dont give up... thats what the insurance company wants you to do! Hang in there!

[CaptnJack]

I suspect that it comes down to the claims department and the specific person handling the case.

It should come down to the policy they agreed to when you paid. I would find that, on paper. And get a lawyer to write a kurt note on letterhead if there's any question about the definition that was in force on the date of your injury.

They can't continually revise your policy at their discretion whenever they wish. You're gonna have to fight. If you need inspiration, go rent Sicko and then have at the bastards

[LCF]

You may certainly reference my accident. The bills are long since paid . . .

[edm81363]

I shot a quick interview with Dan Orr, President of DAN, at the Expo. I have his contact info if you want it.

[guitarmaker]

Huge bummer Matt. Fighting with an insurance company can be almost as painful as the incident! As a new diver considering DAN, I'm now having second thoughts.