T-dock hazard

oldsalt · Post by **oldsalt** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 6:58 pm

I was irritated when this commercial crab boat came in and dropped pots among the divers at the T-dock. I know there are crab there, but really. I may be an oversensitive whiner since I was hit by a boat once and nearly lost an arm. The divers in the forground are an openwater class standing in the shallows doing their first dive.
-Curt

Don-B · Post by **Don-B** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:09 pm

Those guys dont give a s#*t.
last week they(a different boat) had pots spread out all over Rich Passage .
the ferry had to run them over to get thru.

kdupreez · Post by **kdupreez** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:28 pm

Isnt there a "Dive Flag" buoy on the 130' boat?

I think there was still one a couple of months ago and they are supposed to stay well away from that.

Also - who-ever is doing that class is supposed to have a dive flag out to keep boaters out of the area.

Blow-N-Bubbles · Post by **Blow-N-Bubbles** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 4:31 am

WOW.... I think that got read into a little to much ?? Followed by a little sarcasm of your own, but at least it was polite !

Koos is right, there are no dive flags visible in the photo to indicate that any divers are nearby.

Jeff Pack · Post by **Jeff Pack** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 5:25 am

Jeez, there's another nwdc dont...

Nwbrewer · Post by **Nwbrewer** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 7:10 am

Blow-N-Bubbles wrote:WOW.... I think that got read into a little to much ?? Followed by a little sarcasm of your own, but at least it was polite !

Koos is right, there are no dive flags visible in the photo to indicate that any divers are nearby.

Just because it's not in the photo doesn't mean it's not there. The line to the 130' boat has a permanent dive flag attached to it. Unless somebody did some major work to remove it in the last week, it's still there.

2loud4u · Post by **2loud4u** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 7:11 am

As close as that boat is, the dive flag might be on the far side of it??

Joshua Smith · Post by **Joshua Smith** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:55 am

Note- deleted my post. Seems I over reacted.

defied · Post by **defied** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:06 am

Jeff Pack wrote:Jeez, there's another nwdc dont...

Jeff,
I believe it's called being objective. You've got a photo that only shows a boat, and divers, no flag. The OP can respond to that message with "Dang, there was no flag!", or "Nah, the flag was just to the right of the photo."

D

Joshua Smith · Post by **Joshua Smith** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:15 am

defied wrote:
Jeff Pack wrote:Jeez, there's another nwdc dont...
Jeff,
I believe it's called being objective. You've got a photo that only shows a boat, and divers, no flag. The OP can respond to that message with "Dang, there was no flag!", or "Nah, the flag was just to the right of the photo."

D

Jeff was refering to my (now deleted) post.

defied · Post by **defied** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:59 am

Joshua Smith wrote:
defied wrote:
Jeff Pack wrote:Jeez, there's another nwdc dont...
Jeff,
I believe it's called being objective. You've got a photo that only shows a boat, and divers, no flag. The OP can respond to that message with "Dang, there was no flag!", or "Nah, the flag was just to the right of the photo."

D
Jeff was refering to my (now deleted) post.

Ah, roger that. He seems the sensitive type this week.

D

oldsalt · Post by **oldsalt** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:19 pm

There were two dive flags. One is hidden by the boat and the other to the left of the picture.
-Curt

CaptnJack · Post by **CaptnJack** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:27 pm

The crab boat looks to be at least 100ft maybe 200ft away from the divers. And there's no obligation to stay XYZ feet away from a dive flag anyway. A "permanent dive flag" is essentially meaningless, its not supposed to be flown when divers aren't in the water.
As callous as it sounds, its no blood, no foul.

eliseaboo · Post by **eliseaboo** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:28 am

CaptnJack wrote:The crab boat looks to be at least 100ft maybe 200ft away from the divers. And there's no obligation to stay XYZ feet away from a dive flag anyway. A "permanent dive flag" is essentially meaningless, its not supposed to be flown when divers aren't in the water.
As callous as it sounds, its no blood, no foul.

I couldn't believe that was true, so I went to look it up...looks like there was at one point a requirement to stay 200ft away (http://www.boaterexam.com/usa/washingto ... =6&page=15), but I can't find it linked directly from WA Parks and Rec. All it says in the current boater handbook is that if you're diving you must be flying them...not what boaters should do when they encounter one.

That is severely disappointing...

CaptnJack · Post by **CaptnJack** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:31 am

eliseaboo wrote:
CaptnJack wrote:The crab boat looks to be at least 100ft maybe 200ft away from the divers. And there's no obligation to stay XYZ feet away from a dive flag anyway. A "permanent dive flag" is essentially meaningless, its not supposed to be flown when divers aren't in the water.
As callous as it sounds, its no blood, no foul.
I couldn't believe that was true, so I went to look it up...looks like there was at one point a requirement to stay 200ft away (http://www.boaterexam.com/usa/washingto ... =6&page=15), but I can't find it linked directly from WA Parks and Rec. All it says in the current boater handbook is that if you're diving you must be flying them...not what boaters should do when they encounter one.

That is severely disappointing...

Pretty much, the new State Parks boater education materials are at least teaching what a dive flag is. But how far away to stay is left up to judgement and common sense, which are sorely lacking in many.

Personally if there are divers in the water I stay away about 100ft if I'm at idle speed and can see their locations from bubbles. I may get closer to e.g. tie off to the same mooring buoy. I'm like 100+ yards if I'm faster than idle speed. If you're a bubble-less diver you should realize that even savy boaters can't figure out where you are at all.

kdupreez · Post by **kdupreez** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:00 am

yeah I also thought vessels not engaged in diving operations should remain at least 200 feet from a displayed flag.

not sure I it's just a common sense thing when educating boaters it if it's actually law.

my common sense says if a commercial crabbing vessel runs over a diver and there was multiple dive flags that he ignored, he might be in a spot of trouble.

CaptnJack · Post by **CaptnJack** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:13 am

kdupreez wrote:yeah I also thought vessels not engaged in diving operations should remain at least 200 feet from a displayed flag.

There's no minimum distance at all. The rules of the road do not address how boats/ships should or should not approach swimmers or divers. Some cities and counties have attempted to write rules for this circumstance, but they are sporadic, inconsistent and basically ignored.

dive defensively, the law of tonnage applies.

kdupreez · Post by **kdupreez** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:18 am

CaptnJack wrote:.. the law of tonnage applies.

Hahaha - no kidding! I wish damn pedestrians had the same commons sense !

CaptnJack · Post by **CaptnJack** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:24 am

Historically, Jefferson County has been the most aggressive about dive flags. To the point of issuing tickets for non-compliant divers. Mark and Don (Down time) have made them more aware that boaters zooming by said dive flags are at least if not more of an actual problem than lazy divers failing to fly a flag.

Northwest Dive Club

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