Fin/foot problem(s)

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Nwcid
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Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Nwcid »

So I just did a few first last week and it was awesome. This also meant I had a few problem.

We did a week in Bonaire last week. This was my first trip out of the county. It was my 3rd trip to tropical waters with the prior being Maui and the Big island. It was the most dives I have ever done in a day/week. It is the first time I have dove in nothing but shorts and a rash guard.

We ended up doing a total of 20 dives in 6 day which means several I did 4 dives in a day. The most before that was 3, with a total of 13 dives over 6 days.

On my previous 2 trips I have worn Deep Sea 5mm (I think) boots and Oceanic Viper fins. I had no foot problems at all other then I can frog kick worth a damn and they are to "flimsy" for my leg power. I use Turtles fins with my DS and this summer I bought a set of HOG fins with smaller foot pockets to use with my wetsuit. I used them a couple of times this summer with no problems and liked having the same finning I do in my DS.

On about day 3 of our trip my feet were starting to get pretty tore up. By day 5 I didn't want to walk, but I was still finning away because I was not going to stop diving. My feet looked like a hiker with new boots on. The top of my middle 3 toes on both feet were raw. I was a bit sore on the sides of my feet but no marks. My left heal was raw where the spring strap hit and the right one was sore. I had bandaids and cream all over my feet.

Obviously there was something rubbing, I get that. Since fin pocket are what they are how do you address this problem?

On a side note I got really good at back finning. I use to think I was not quite doing it right. I found out when you are only in shorts, a rash guard with an AL80 there is not much resistance to moving. Being in trim is just as easy.

Here are a few pics from my trip for anyone interested, https://www.facebook.com/john.nokes.965/photos_all
John

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Dusty2
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Dusty2 »

I never dive without shoes. You can get away with it if you us pocket fins but the big fins we us here have a lot more resistance that normal warn water fins so your feet are going to take a beating. Either a thin boot/sneakers or neoprene socks can help. A cheap pair of sneakers or surfer booties works well.
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spatman
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by spatman »

Nwcid wrote:Obviously there was something rubbing, I get that. Since fin pocket are what they are how do you address this problem?
Combinations of different boots and fins. Not much else you can do.
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Nwcid
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Nwcid »

Sorry Dusty if I didn't make it clear, but I did have my Deep Sea 5mm boots on with the HOG's.

I had kinda thought about shoes, similar to boots like you would use with a DS. What would you wear under them for socks? Just regular socks? Thin socks of some kind? Special material?
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Dusty2
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Dusty2 »

Wow even with 5Mil boots on???? Maybe mother nature was trying to tell you something???
They do have thin neoprene socks probably a lot better than any kind of normal socks but I see a lot of warm water divers wearing tennis.
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Nwcid »

Well even with 5mm boots that does not solve rubbing problems. Just like hiking boots that are not broke in will cause rubbing issues. Difference between boots and fins though is I am not sure you can "break in" fins.
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CaptnJack
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by CaptnJack »

Fins will never "break in" so why not go back to your Oceanic fins?

If I were rubbing my feet raw on a trip I'd just buy new fins, assuming I wasn't stuck on a liveaboard.
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GearHead
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by GearHead »

If you want to keep the HOG fins, you could try a different style boot (softer, thinner sole) or add lycra fin socks inside the boots to alleviate the chaffing. Unfortunately, the damage is already done for this trip.

I have a set of HOG fins in size XL which work fine with both my drysuit boots and Fourth Element Amphibian neoprene boots. Like you, I've found that they work well for precision fin kicks.
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Nwcid »

The reason I replaced the Oceanic is they were too soft for me. Even on a medium flutter kick they bend 90*. That is a lot of wasted effort. It feels like riding a bike in too high of a gear. Sure the pedaling is easy, but you have to work your ass off to go.

With paddle fins I get good control. I get more "motion" with less effort.

I think I will be looking into different boots/shoes.
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CaptnJack
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by CaptnJack »

Nwcid wrote:The reason I replaced the Oceanic is they were too soft for me. Even on a medium flutter kick they bend 90*. That is a lot of wasted effort. It feels like riding a bike in too high of a gear. Sure the pedaling is easy, but you have to work your ass off to go.

With paddle fins I get good control. I get more "motion" with less effort.

I think I will be looking into different boots/shoes.
Yeah that's why sitting still with a camera, drift, and scooter dives are so popular ;)

Alas harder plastic is then transfering the load to the edge of the foot pocket and then abrading your skin in that spot. Keds with neoprene socks might help but I doubt it.
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Gdog
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Gdog »

I had exactly the same issue, with the same boots. My toes were raw. I went to one of the dive shops in Bonaire, the one by Joes BBQ, bought a diff. pair of boots, not Deep Sea, and within a few days my toes were healing, problem solved. I was able to continue diving the entire time. The toe area inside the Deep Sea boots had a ridge or seam and that was responsible.
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Nwcid »

Next time I am in a town with a dive shop I will look at some different neoprene boots.

I am also tossing the idea of finding some shoes that are lightweight that would fit in the fin pocket. Just not sure what I would wear for "socks" under them. The GF has soft feet in her Fusion and instead of getting rock boots (no local dive shop) ended up getting a pair of wrestling shoes on sale for $6 at the local sporting goods store. So far they have been on about 50 dives.
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LCF
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by LCF »

Sounds like your spring straps may be too tight -- also, I find I really like the straps with the rubber overlay that spreads the pressure out over a larger area.

Wearing a Lycra or other sock under the booties has also helped me. If sand gets in between your boot and your toes, your skin is TOAST.
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by ljjames »

I actually had opposite problem. When in Maui my spring straps were too loose so let my foot flop around too much and start causing hot spots. To solve the issue I stuffed a couple washcloths in the toes of my fins so that it actually sprung the straps and kept my feet from moving around too much. If the straps are too tight you'll get cramps that stop the dive (at least for me) before chafing.
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BillZ
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by BillZ »

Mole skin and neoprene socks can help out but it sounds like you need better fitting/quality boots.

Also, at a place like Bonaire where your diving 4-5-6 times a day you want to make sure that your feet completely air out and dry between dives. If not you can develop a case of "trench foot" where your skin becomes soft and can easily get rubbed off. A good pair of flip-flops are your best friend.

.
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Nwcid »

All good pointers.

As for the "heel" rubbing, it was just a small spot on the medial side and not across the whole back. My fins were initially loose the last time(s) I had used them but tightened them before the trip. Now they feel like the fit properly and are not too loose, but I can feel "slop" in my toe area. I do understand why/how this causes issues. Since the fins are the shape they are I am looking for potential ways to fix it.

I had thought about putting something in the toes. I was almost wondering if I could find some kind of closed cell foam that I could "fit" to me and the fin and leave it in semi permanently.

One of my jobs is Wildland Fire Medic. Our job is to take care of the folks fighting the big fires we get in the summer. We do a lot of foot care so I know all about the issues. I will be stocking a little better kit with next time we go somewhere. This was just my first experience diving this way so there was a learning curve.
John

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CaptnJack
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by CaptnJack »

You can also go dry. Shell drysuits (like the TLS 350 thickness) with a set of long underwear underneath are dreamy to dive in the tropics. They roll up as small or smaller than many wetsuits, and avoid the trenchfoot chafe from having wet feet. Also avoid post dive chills since there's little or no evaporative cooling. And lastly avoid having special fins and straps, just go down one size from whatever you wear locally.
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WylerBear
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by WylerBear »

All of us on my first trip to Bonaire had this same problem and spent a lot of post dive time putting on neosporin and bandaids. But on the second trip I got smart and brought along some of those thin neoprene socks to wear under my boots and no problem! The others on the second trip were having issues the first couple of days, went to a dive shop and bought some of the socks and then had no problems after that. Your boot is rubbing your bare skin obviously. Use a sock and you may be able to alleviate the problem quickly and cheaply.
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Grateful Diver
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Grateful Diver »

Socks.

On my first three Caribbean dive trips (Belize, Roatan and Bonaire) the tops of my toes got so tore up it looked like I'd stuck them underneath a lawn mower. When I posted about the problem on ScubaBoard someone recommended wearing socks inside my booties. With no change in gear, my toes didn't get a single blister the next trip ... and that was something like 28 dives in six days of diving.

I've been wearing socks on my tropical trips ever since, and never once got a blister.

You don't need neoprene socks. For that matter, in warm water you don't need any socks other than the ones you wear every day. I usually use the same white cotton socks I wear inside my work boots every day ... and they work just fine.

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Nwcid
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Nwcid »

Great to know Bob. I will try that for sure next time.

In the water my feet were sore, but it was easily overcome. Out of the water shoes of an kinda hurt and so did walking. I had bandaids and cream all over my feet to make it tolerable.
John

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ArcticDiver
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by ArcticDiver »

Had the same problem. Bought some cheap synthetic dress socks. Made sure the socks fit snugly, not tight or loose. No more problem. I plan to use them again soon.

By the way the same tactic works for tender feet on land.

Read Bob's post. He is the only other person I've met who does the sock bit. Great Minds, eh?
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Blue Abyss
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Blue Abyss »

I have used socks inside my booties for years in the tropics. I used to get blisters after about 2 days of diving but with socks I am good for a couple of weeks. I avoid cotton socks simply because they start to stink pretty quickly. I go for the synthetics
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PeninsulaDiver
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by PeninsulaDiver »

Synthetic Socks = Bingo!

Speaking from experience, with that much diving in a short period, add the synthetic socks and don't change anything else and your problem will go away and you will be a happy tropical diver. :partydance:
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Gdog
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by Gdog »

I like the synthetic socks idea. Where do you get them?
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PeninsulaDiver
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Re: Fin/foot problem(s)

Post by PeninsulaDiver »

If you are late to the party, as I was, you can buy them at your destination shop. However, you may not have your pick of colors. I didn't have the luxury of colors and ended with these.
image.jpg

Fortunately I am into comfort rather than fashion. Or, you can <insert search engine of choice> "Scuba Tube Socks" .

Before I forget, thanks to FlyingV for the tip. :joshsmith:

They allowed me to complete all the dives on a very aggressive schedule.


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