Whites Fusion Dry Suits

[Paladin4Christ]

I just learned about these suits and am intrigued by the concept of a uni-size bag and a tight skin that is replaceable. The idea that this tight skin minimizes the risk of having an air bubble in my dry suit while still alleviating suit squeeze is extremely attractive to me. (I have always had a fear of blowing to the surface feet first. My original instructor told some horror stories about the possibility of this happening, during my dry suit course. Even thought this has never come close to happening, I can't shake the idea from the back of my mind and every time I ascend it rears it's ugly head.)

I currently dive a DUI FLEX 50/50 and like the ease of entry with the diagonal zipper across the chest. I also like how durable it is with the crushed neoprene bottom with extra crushed neoprene knee pads. The only complaint I have is the inevitable air pockets inherent to dry suits.

I am interested in opinions/experiences everyone has in regard to the Whites Fusion Tech or Bullet Dry Suit. Is the concept as sound as it looks? Does it eliminate the "air pockets" that my DUI suit has while allowing me to still dive dry? Is the entry system well designed or difficult to enter? Is it as durable as my crushed neoprene or is tearing, cutting or abrasions a problem? Please add any other information I should consider.

On a side note, I would also be interested in idea or procedures people use to alleviate my fear of out of control accents possibly feet first. (I know it's probably but I'm sure I'm not the only person out there with concerns like this.)
My suit does have the adjustable arm vent that can be fully closed or fully opened.

Thanks in advance for sharing the knowledge and not flaming me too bad.

[Jeff Pack]

I've dove a Whites Fusion for over a year now, and its the easiest dry suit to dive. There is very little bubble to manage, as opposed to the more bag type suits.

Its self donning, but takes some minor instruction how to don/doff it.

Its an odd sandwich bag kind of fit that bothers some people. I dont use my suit for buoyancy, just enough to take the squeeze off.

The user replaceable seals are awesome. My only real complaint are those damned big ass sitech glove rings, as they get in the way of my light.

The Whites rock boots are awesome for climbing about on rocks, etc.

Silicon seals tear easily, so I use a 60/40 baby shampoo mix, which makes the wrist seals slide on/off much easier, and less wear and tear on them. Neck seals seem to last much much longer.

[GearHead]

I don't know if the Whites suits do a better job at reducing air spaces with their tight skin or not, but I suspect not. I tried a DUI membrane suit during a drysuit orientation, and didn't like the bagginess. I much prefer my Bare XCS2 compressed neoprene suit. That plus using just the right amount of weight keeps the air bubble very manageable.

You should have learned a couple maneuvers during your drysuit class or orientation for recovering from a feet first ascent. They are variations of a tuck and roll. Bring your knees toward your chest and use your arms to get head up. I was drilled on this in a pool before I used a drysuit in open water. A pair of ankle weights can also help. With correct weight distribution and a minimal amount of air in your suit, you should be able to do an easy controlled ascent in horizontal trim, without worrying about ending feet up.

[KneeDeep]

I took my dry suit cert during my OW with a Whites (Sport skin) and loved it. Though I hadn't at the time any comparison, the suit worked great. Then I got a garbage bag suit (USIA Sport) that was a bit too big for me. I dove my garbage bag for about 90 dives and also had the same 'restlessness' of accent bubble management.

Then my wife got her OW and we were looking at dry suits for her, we tried numerous brands and then (we both) rented a Whites for a demo weekend. For myself, this was a huge change of bubble management then from my USIA suit. Short story... My wife and I both have Whites suits.

I first got the Whites suit (L/Xl) with the Sport's skin, my wife (SM/MED) skin is the Fusion Fit ('women' cut). If I wanted to, I could actually dive her suit, though might be a bit short in height (I'm 6'), but still doable with the liner size.

I just got the Bullet skin and love it, the sport does work fine, but with the added thickness of the Bullet, air placement through out the suit is more 'even'. Where as in the sport, I can feel air movement. Head up or Feet up, the Bullet has enough squeeze with the neoprene to keep the bubble even, I don't have that in the Sport's skin. The Sport's skin is just a stretchable rash guard, were as the Bullet is about 2-2.5mm neoprene. I've never tried the Tech. The Sport is way to thin to support pockets... Tech and Bullet both come with pockets.

Entry to the Whites suit (Sport or any of the others) do take a bit of used to, due to the '2' layer effect. I just roll the legs as much as possible from the outside, to minimize the foot entry travel, and then pull the inner lining up first, then the skin. Takes a couple times to get it down, but now it's a breeze.

I also got the replaceable seals, and it's GREAT. As Jeff stated, the silicon wrists seem to be less durable, but hella easy to change out, even fully geared up (with tanks) can be completed in under 5min. I personally got the oval dry gloves, and once I figured out the lining up to install, they have worked flawlessly (keeping dry) every time. The only problems I started out having was removal, as the glove would pull out until I cut the glove to correct length.

[CaptnJack]

On a side note, I would also be interested in idea or procedures people use to alleviate my fear of out of control accents possibly feet first. (I know it's probably but I'm sure I'm not the only person out there with concerns like this.)
My suit does have the adjustable arm vent that can be fully closed or fully opened.

Don't even think about closing this. Maybe one or two clicks in the closed direction but 2 click is a max.
Dial in your weighting so you are carrying exactly how much weight you need and no more than 2lbs extra (in winter esp it'll allow you to avoid freezing). Then you won't need so much of a bubble in your suit or BC in the first place. Weight check with an empty tank. Lastly avoid using your suit for the major portion of your buoynacy control until you are more comfortable with it. Learn to use the butt dump on your BC so you can vent gas from an inverted position if you are starting to rise a little, pre-emptively avoiding any need for tucking and rolling. Use fin keepers if your feet have a tendency to slip out of your boots if there's a little gas in them.

Avoid: ankle weights and light weight fins. Something modestly negative like the Jets or Hollis F-1s works well for the vast majority of drysuit divers. Turtles if you have giant feet/boots.

[Paladin4Christ]

Don't even think about closing this. Maybe one or two clicks in the closed direction but 2 click is a max.
Dial in your weighting so you are carrying exactly how much weight you need and no more than 2lbs extra (in winter esp it'll allow you to avoid freezing). Then you won't need so much of a bubble in your suit or BC in the first place. Weight check with an empty tank. Lastly avoid using your suit for the major portion of your buoyancy control until you are more comfortable with it. Learn to use the butt dump on your BC so you can vent gas from an inverted position if you are starting to rise a little, pre-emptively avoiding any need for tucking and rolling. Use fin keepers if your feet have a tendency to slip out of your boots if there's a little gas in them.

Avoid: ankle weights and light weight fins. Something modestly negative like the Jets or Hollis F-1s works well for the vast majority of drysuit divers. Turtles if you have giant feet/boots.

Very interesting! I was taught to use the dry suit as my main flotation device and to keep the valve almost fully closed and just depress it when I needed to let air out.

I want to make sure I'm understanding correctly. Keep the vent fully open and if needed "close it two clicks ONLY" (said in my best Capt Ramius impression). As I understand it, then the suit will self vent or is this a gross misunderstanding?

I have not worn ankle weights in awhile because they made me too feet heavy and I'm trying to get as good of buoyancy as possible and a neutral trim has been the goal. Currently I use Scubapro Twin Jets and have not used Jets or Hollis F-1's. I chose the Twin Jets because of the concept and the color of the fins - it's a nice focal point in our excellent Puget Sound waters.

To answer the above suggestion, I was trained on the tuck and roll and practice the heck out of it in the pool. I just do not ever want to have to do it in open water at depth.

[Jeff Pack]

Padi teaches drysuit for buoyancy, others dont. I prefer my BCD for buoyancy, and enough air in my suit to remove squeeze.

OTOH, for fine adjustments, I still use my suit, as BCD tends to be larger adjustments. Plus I can vent faster with my BC,than the suit.

Your options may vary/

[GearHead]

CaptnJack is correct - keep your shoulder valve open enough so that it will vent properly when you lift your arm. If you have to close it more than a half turn to keep it from venting during good trim, then you are probably carrying too much gas in your suit.

[CaptnJack]

Very interesting! I was taught to use the dry suit as my main flotation device and to keep the valve almost fully closed and just depress it when I needed to let air out.

No wonder you are scared of ending up a feet first rocket to the surface. This is how my wife was taught in about 1988; I haven't known anyone diving a drysuit "manually" venting for many years.

Leave the valve 90+% open. Roll slightly to the right to move the (limited) gas to the upper left and let it self vent. Raising left arm to vent your BC will also allow it to vent. This is the only time you might crank the valve closed, to temporarily vent your BC and not vent the suit (say in winter when you are a bit chilly already and want to hold onto warm suit gas).

The suit will not shrink wrap unless you descend, the undergarment will be in equalibrium with water pressure at whatever depth you're at. Much less complicated and takes much less bandwidth.

[Paladin4Christ]

Now I can't wait to hit the water tomorrow and test out my new found knowledge. Hopefully that will fix my issue and save me some $$$. This will make the wife happy, which we all know is the key to having a happy life.

[Gdog]

Chris, I was also trained to use my drysuit for bouyancy (SSI). However, I was not trained in a closed valve. I leave my valve 2 clicks from full open. With proper weighting, the bubble size is very managable, and small. To vent, I just roll my shoulder up or raise my arm.

[CaptnJack]

Now I can't wait to hit the water tomorrow and test out my new found knowledge. Hopefully that will fix my issue and save me some $$$. This will make the wife happy, which we all know is the key to having a happy life.

Have fun, let us know how it goes. I think you'll be alot more relaxed in general once you get use to the roll/shrug style of dumping from the suit. Regardless of whether you still use the suit for all of your buoyancy or put some buoyancy gas in your BC.

[Waynne Fowler]

Very interesting! I was taught to use the dry suit as my main flotation device and to keep the valve almost fully closed and just depress it when I needed to let air out.

I suspect that is why you 'fear' a feet first ascent... that and being told 'horror stories'.
Do as Richard told you and you will find you'll have better buoyancy control, you'll stay warmer longer and go through less gas AND you'll most likely never have an issue with a FFA.

[Paladin4Christ]

Worked like a dream. For the first time diving in a dry suit I did not worry about hitting the surface faster than 30 feet a minute. hehe

I was colder than normal but I'm sure with some adjustment I'll whip that problem. I'll take chilly over constant worry. I actually surfaced with 1300 psi after a 60 minute dive! That has to be a first for me!

Thank you everyone. No need to buy a Fusion if my DUI works like this!

You all ROCK!

[Mateo1147]

Worked like a dream. For the first time diving in a dry suit I did not worry about hitting the surface faster than 30 feet a minute. hehe

I was colder than normal but I'm sure with some adjustment I'll whip that problem. I'll take chilly over constant worry. I actually surfaced with 1300 psi after a 60 minute dive! That has to be a first for me!

Thank you everyone. No need to buy a Fusion if my DUI works like this!

You all ROCK!

[LCF]

I realize you have solved your problem, but I thought I'd write a little bit about the Fusion suits, since I've been diving them for over five years.

The pros: VERY hard to hurt. My first Fusion I had for about 450 dives. I had three leaks. One I made when I put the p-valve in. One was a pinhole in the right upper arm -- I have no idea how it happened, and fixed it with a piece of Gorilla tape. The third was a huge honking tear in the back of the suit that I got when I fell off a dive boat in Florida, and I defy any suit to have survived that incident unhurt. (Luckily, I did.)

If you buy the Sport skin, the suit is ridiculously light and easy to pack. Even with the Tech skin, it's not bad. I wouldn't recommend the Bullet skin at all, as you lose most of the things (lightness, quick drying, flexibility) that I think make the suit attractive. I bought the Bullet skin. It was bright, screaming, gorgeous red. I don't dive it. That should tell anybody who knows me how little I thought of it.

Diving the suit is very easy. Fit is unimportant, as long as it's big ENOUGH, and the seals fit. Air-trapping is not an issue, but you CAN maintain enough gas in the suit to stay warm and comfortable. (I put all the gas I need for buoyancy in the suit with a single tank. The gas to get the suit comfy and the undergarment lofted is about all I need to be neutral.)

Price: You can get a Sport Fusion (with UG, I believe) from DRIS for 1400. It's a much better suit that the standard bilams that run in that price range, and MUCH cheaper than the high-end suits like DUI and Santi.

The cons: Footgear. The suit comes with ridiculously oversized fabric socks, and you have to wear something over them. I don't like this; I had a boot (and the fin it was in) come off in a cave once, and swore I'd never dive again with anything that could come off my feet. In addition, the contortions required to bend over and place footgear and lace it up or fasten it or zip it are annoying. Yes, you can buy the "attached" Fusion boots. I have never dived them, but I helped student who was trying to get into them, and as a result of that experience, I would never have them myself. On the Fusion with the Tech skin that I used to dive primarily here in Puget Sound, I had TurboSoles installed.

Donning. There is a technique to the Fusion, and you have to learn it. Once you have, it works most of the time, but the days when you are in a hurry and need your gear to cooperate are the days when things get twisted, caught or otherwise won't do what you want. I readily acknowledge that the decision to put the TurboSoles on the suit is responsible for part of my particular problem.

Zippers. I don't find the zipper on the Fusion to be truly self-donning. I have trouble getting the last couple of inches closed. I CAN do it, if there is no one to help me, but it's hard. In addition, my first Fusion zipper failed right where it arches over the shoulder, and I suspect that that's where they will all fail. The shop to which I sent the suit was unable to replace the zipper successful. The outcome of that was HIGHLY satisfactory to me -- but the fact remains that I don't know of anyone who has replaced the zipper on a Fusion.

Overall, I still think the suit is priced well (and the back zip version is ridiculously well priced). It's extremely durable and does not commit the ultimate dry suit sin (leaking) easily. It permits excellent mobility, although some of that is compromised by the SiTech seal system, both in the wrists and in the neck. It's almost ideal for travel, because with the Sport skin, it is extremely light and very malleable.

There is no perfect dry suit, but there is a lot to like about these.

[CaptnJack]

Worked like a dream. For the first time diving in a dry suit I did not worry about hitting the surface faster than 30 feet a minute. hehe

I was colder than normal but I'm sure with some adjustment I'll whip that problem. I'll take chilly over constant worry. I actually surfaced with 1300 psi after a 60 minute dive! That has to be a first for me!

Thank you everyone. No need to buy a Fusion if my DUI works like this!

You all ROCK!

Sweet. Its a bit of an aquired skill to not dump (automatically from just swimming around) and lose all your nice warm suit gas. It'll come with a few dives. You can also experiment with one or two clicks back on the valve from full open. Its hard to know where the sweet spot is on your exact valve since the spring tensions vary a little even amongst valves of the same brand & model. It should still vent (without having to push the button) if you roll right and get the valve to the highest point.