Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

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Highliner
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Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Highliner »

I am gearing up for "Fundies" class. The past deveral years I have been diving the Zeagle Tech BCD. I have used both HP 119s as well as doubled HP 100s and LP 95s. I am assuming that I will have to purchase a new BC. Which manufacturer is the desired brand. I would appreciate a couple of examples of BP, harness and wing configurations. I am planning on a #60 wing and steel BP. Many thanks in advance. DB
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BDub
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by BDub »

I'd contact your instructor for gear recommendations.

Are you planning on taking it in doubles or a single tank?
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CaptnJack
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by CaptnJack »

There is no universally desired brand.

I wouldn't fixate on the 60# wing size, that is honestly on the larger end of needed. For 99% of us something in the 50-60# range is fine for 119s and larger 8" diameter doubles. That will be a little big for double lp85s, lp72s, Al80s (which you may end up using down the road) but still do-able. Obviously wings this large do not really work on single tanks and in the DIR configuration we don't use bungies to make them fit/smaller.

there are examples of good packages on the web here:
http://www.golemgear.com/c-24-combospackages.aspx
http://www.extreme-exposure.com/?q=node/1397
and a package deal "calculator" here: (you'll have to go to different pages to see the wings and plates)
https://www.deepseasupply.com/index.php?page=rigs
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Pez7378
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Pez7378 »

Halcyon.

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LCF
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by LCF »

I agree with Richard. A 60 lb wing works well with big LP steels, stages and deco bottles, but it's overkill for small doubles.

Many brands are just fine. You want a short corrugated hose, and no knob on the end of the string for your dump valve. One inflator, one dump on the left hand underside of the wing. No bungies.

You'll want a stainless steel plate for local diving, almost certainly, and the harness must be continuous (no quick releases).

If you like, I can lend you my copy of Dress for Success, which although dated in some particulars, is still a very good guide to GUE's equipment configuration.
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kdupreez
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by kdupreez »

I'm also gearing up for fundies. Yes, as bizarre as it may seem, even the tec divers and tec instructor types among us could learn from taking a fundies class..

after much soul searching and re-looking at the deep investment in diverite gear I currently have, the obvious choice came down to "The Big H"

for local diving and in order to make your fundies class much more enjoyable, the right equipemt is key.

1. Steel Back Plate
For local diving a steel back plate is for sure a great option to get some of that weight of your waist.

2. Continuous Harness
This is the cheapest of the gear, just get a single 11 ft long 2" webbing and (about $25)

3. 40-50lb Wing (preferably Oval wing)
I have had and dove horse shoes for a long time and recently demoed a oval wing on my doubles rig, it was almost a religious experience to have air in the right places plus dumping didnt require underwater gymnastics to move the air to the bottom left in order to dump!

So, The BP and Harnesses are pretty standard, but for a wing I can wholeheartedly recommend the "Halcyon Evolve 40lb" Wing - I test dove DiveRite, Hollis and Halcyon with the latter being my favourite (albeit most expensive)

my 2c :)
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spatman
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by spatman »

kdupreez wrote:the obvious choice came down to "The Big H"
what made Halcyon "obvious" compared to other brands?
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by CaptnJack »

kdupreez wrote: 3. 40-50lb Wing (preferably Oval wing)
I have had and dove horse shoes for a long time and recently demoed a oval wing on my doubles rig, it was almost a religious experience to have air in the right places plus dumping didnt require underwater gymnastics to move the air to the bottom left in order to dump!

So, The BP and Harnesses are pretty standard, but for a wing I can wholeheartedly recommend the "Halcyon Evolve 40lb" Wing - I test dove DiveRite, Hollis and Halcyon with the latter being my favourite (albeit most expensive)
40lbs Evolve is too small for 119s and a stage etc. It can work, but its much better suited to hp100s/lp85s/al80s

I bought my wings before DSS existed, when Halcyon's only real competitor was Diverite. Golem probably existed along with Agir but neither were known. Anyway, I have a 55lb wing for big doubles, a 40lb singles wing and a 38lb doubles wing for al80s in MX.
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Kees »

kdupreez wrote: I can wholeheartedly recommend the "Halcyon Evolve 40lb" Wing
Second that. It's a delightful wing. Comes in a 60lb size as well.
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Grateful Diver »

I'm a big fan of Deep Sea Supply rigs ... for doubles, their Torus 49# wing is really sweet. Not as wide-body as the Halcyon Evolve 60, but with enough lift capacity to handle even larger 8" diameter cylinders. Plus you get that world-class Tobin personal service.

I'd recommend at least taking a serious look at it before deciding what to buy ...

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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by kdupreez »

Agreed that a 60lb is what you want for double 119's with stages..

but if you are going to do fundies with anything less than 119 doubles, then the wing is slightly big and annoying on HP100's - I have one of the old 70lb horse shoe halcyons and its waay too big and cumbersone..

so, totally depends on what gear you want to use for fundies.. remember, less is more wrt being streamlined for a good solid tec pass on fundies..

my rig will be double HP100's = 40lb wing

if you opt for huge LP cylinders cause thats what you have, then go for the 60lb. dumping air on an oval wing is much much easier and it trims out a little easier because the air can move freely and uniformly to where you need it.

but either way, really think about a oval/360 wing versus a horsehoe. and also remember "no bungees, tabs, etc."

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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by ljjames »

:) and as Koos, Kees, myself and several others have found, your local community is generally incredibly generous with regards to letting you 'try before you buy'.

Thats how I ended up with a 40lb evolve. I have a 40lb explorer wing (for OC, I dive mostly HP102's, with and without stages) but borrowed an Evolve from Lamont when i took fundies last year, because he'd gone on and on and on about how amazing it was to trim out, etc... I didn't believe him, and didn't bite for months and months and months, and then just before fundies (having been diving the CCR exclusively for the prior 8 months or so) I figured i needed every bit of help i could get, so, what the heck, might as well give it a try. He almost didn't get his wing back ;)

Anyhow, if any of you (spatty, you too) want to take it for a spin side by side with an explorer (okay, maybe not at same time but a couple dives in a row) and compare for yourself, let me know and we'll figure out a way to arrange it.
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lamont
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by lamont »

I've got both a 40# evolve and 60# evolve, which is the right way to go ultimately.

I'd suggest a 40# evolve to start with, since that'll work even on the larger steel doubles at first -- and once you seriously start using double-130s, plus a bottom stage and two deco bottles, then your dives start costing enough that a 60# wing will be the least of your financial worries...

YMMV...
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by seainggreen »

CaptnJack wrote: 40lbs Evolve is too small for 119s and a stage etc. It can work, but its much better suited to hp100s/lp85s/al80s
.
I would have to disagree about the 40lbs wing being too small for 119s. I dove a 40lbs wing for Tech 2 no problem with the full kit, including double 95s, 130s and 119s. Floaty and good, and not a buttload of excess wing all over the place. Just my experience though, YMMV. :) All this means is that if you're new to doubles and wings, you should test out several if possible and find the best fit for you.
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CaptnJack
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by CaptnJack »

seainggreen wrote:
CaptnJack wrote: 40lbs Evolve is too small for 119s and a stage etc. It can work, but its much better suited to hp100s/lp85s/al80s
.
I would have to disagree about the 40lbs wing being too small for 119s. I dove a 40lbs wing for Tech 2 no problem with the full kit, including double 95s, 130s and 119s. Floaty and good, and not a buttload of excess wing all over the place. Just my experience though, YMMV. :) All this means is that if you're new to doubles and wings, you should test out several if possible and find the best fit for you.
Eh my suit won't hold much gas on the surface (exiting via the neck) and I carry quite a bit of lead to avoid freezing, so I'm rather "heavy" to start. Personally I find the smaller wings too narrow for the fat tanks, but I also have a tank mounted argon bottle which makes them wide too. My smallest doubles wing is actually smaller than my single tank wing but its definately too narrow for doubles. Its a 38lb explorer which isn't made anymore, downright dreamy in MX. I'd still suggest something a little bigger than 40 but smaller than 60. But that's just me, I've never dove a 60lb wing anyway.
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Waynne Fowler
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Waynne Fowler »

Not intending to hijack the thread but a quick question to those that have the evolve wings.... I seem to have trouble with my side to side attitude in my evolves when I'm carrying stage bottles... when I wiggle air to the left side, within a few minutes the air migrates back to the right side again making me list to the left... I find myself constantly readjusting this.....

That's the only problem I have with my evolves, so when I carry stages (more than one anyway) I use my horseshoe shaped explorer wing. I'd have to agree that my evolve is simpler to dump via the rear valve.
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Grateful Diver »

I use an Evolve 60 when carrying stages/deco bottles, and haven't experienced any problems.

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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by spatman »

CaptnJack wrote:Eh my suit won't hold much gas on the surface (exiting via the neck) and I carry quite a bit of lead to avoid freezing, so I'm rather "heavy" to start.
same here. though i don't have a lot of time in doubles, i do know that since i wear a bit of lead along with my twin 100s, a 40lb wing probably wouldn't be good for me. my DSS 49lb wing seems just right with a 40cf bottle so far.
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by lamont »

Grateful Diver wrote:I use an Evolve 60 when carrying stages/deco bottles, and haven't experienced any problems.
yeah, it might just be getting used to the wing. if i'm compensating for anything its entirely automatic.

the only issue i can recall with side-to-side stability, was one time hauling 3 empty Al80 stages on one side with a 5# weight on the other and that didn't work so hot..
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by ljjames »

what types of stage/deco bottles are you diving when you experience this?
Waynne Fowler wrote:Not intending to hijack the thread but a quick question to those that have the evolve wings.... I seem to have trouble with my side to side attitude in my evolves when I'm carrying stage bottles... when I wiggle air to the left side, within a few minutes the air migrates back to the right side again making me list to the left... I find myself constantly readjusting this.....

That's the only problem I have with my evolves, so when I carry stages (more than one anyway) I use my horseshoe shaped explorer wing. I'd have to agree that my evolve is simpler to dump via the rear valve.
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Grateful Diver »

For physical size comparisons ... here are the Evolve 60 and DSS Torus 49 ...

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... and here are the Torus 49 and Evolve 40 ...

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Highliner
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Highliner »

Thanks all for the expertise! I am leaning toward the Halcyon Evolve 60 with harness. Two more questions...

1) Which accessories should I consider weight pouches etc. (I use #30 without BP Zeagle Tech)
2) Should I order the standard harness or do I need to know more prior to pulling the trigger?
3} Can you point me in the direction of a dealer? Can you purchase these at UW Sports (I have good pricing there)?

Thanks again everyone! ...I will be able to thank some of you in person soon.

Dan
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by ljjames »

For Halcyon Gear I am quite sure Tacoma Scuba has everything in stock.

UW sports has Hollis gear for backplates and such in the store, and ask for Rachel, she can help you pick the right toys ;)
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Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by kdupreez »

If at al possible I would really suggest a test dive in 60 and 40, these are expensive toys to buy the wrong size for what you need.

I was set on getting a 60 until I saw it's size vs 40 and test dove the 40

Keep in mind the halcyon wings are fairly wide bodied to prevent bladder pinch.

Look at both..
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Re: Gearing up for Fundies...which BC?

Post by Waynne Fowler »

ljjames wrote:what types of stage/deco bottles are you diving when you experience this?
I use the SO80's.... I should add that it isn't a problem till I use 2 80's, it's not a prob with 1-80cf and 1-40cf...
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