Black Dragon 7/27/08

Tell us your tale of coming nose-to-nose with a 6 gill [--this big--], or about your vacation to turquoise warm waters. Share your adventures here!
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Kirby
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Kirby » Fri Aug 01, 2008 5:15 pm

Nice report on the dive. Biggest rock fish I have ever seen under there. I was very appreciative of whoever it was who laid that line from the rail back to the upline. I had a tense moment looking for it, didn't want to let go for fear of getting blown by the line as the current increased, and didn't want to shoot off the deck blind. It was the hardest I have ever had to work at 160 ft, and alot of travel time for only 25 min on the bottom, but great company, and good times. My heart goes out to the folks who never made it to the wreck. Good news is, it's still there waiting for next time.

Just signed on for the Coaster dive on the 24th, need a dive buddy for the trip. Anyone happen to be going that would like to team up? drop me a PM or call.

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Romer Treece
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Romer Treece » Fri Aug 01, 2008 2:10 pm

yeah we'll clean some of that up, but the surface supplied light cables I'm using; I'm gonna cut those and leave those behind. :supz:

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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by CaptnJack » Fri Aug 01, 2008 2:03 pm

Romer Treece wrote:We're going back in August to film more for the documentary, so we will tackle more then. :salute:


awesome :smt038 I expect a clean ship by the time we arrive in early October :smt065
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Romer Treece » Fri Aug 01, 2008 12:35 pm

We're going back in August to film more for the documentary, so we will tackle more then. :salute:

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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Grateful Diver » Fri Aug 01, 2008 12:01 pm

CaptnJack wrote:How is pull and glide line installed??

It's simple, if you're not concerned about removing the line at the end of the dive (which obviously they weren't).

Ain't sayin' that's what happened ... just suggesting it as a possibility ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by CaptnJack » Fri Aug 01, 2008 12:00 pm

Dan
If you don't get to it, we'll try and grab at least some of it. Sounds like there's alot more than we'll be able to tackle ourselves tho.
RJ
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Romer Treece » Fri Aug 01, 2008 11:46 am

Yeah we were just talking about doing this. The problem is it will probably take a couple dives at the least to get it all. These pics don't do the destruction justice. I mean it is all over the place!! Not only cave line but climbing rope (which we grappled) 4 anchors (just what I saw) which have a crap load of line each connected to them (although we recovered one) and various other bits of line. Not only is it tangled around the WHOLE wreck but at least two ends are floating free in the current. It is what I would call someones pre-wreck penetration class nightmare. :angryfire: :angryfire:

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CaptnJack
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by CaptnJack » Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:08 am

How is pull and glide line installed??

I don't think this was "practice". This was being told about line in a class or something and running it (here) cause they didn't know any better. Obviously they didn't really use it to navigate, just eff around. When I did the BDragon last August vis was 50+ft and navigation was easy peazy. No line, scooters.
Sounder wrote:Under normal circumstances, I would never tell another man how to shave his balls... but this device should not be kept secret.

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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Grateful Diver » Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:58 am

CaptnJack wrote:That line looks "this summer fresh". I know it wasn't there August '07 when I did the BDragon. I am headed there in October and will try to pull some out of there. It looks poorly run and I can't figure out why they ran it anyway?? Hopefully it will be easy to remove.

I can think of some potential reasons ...

- "guideline" in poor vis
- "pull and glide" line in current
- because they needed practice

All of those (plus the fact that it looks poorly run) would suggest divers who are newly-teched ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by CaptnJack » Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:22 am

That line looks "this summer fresh". I know it wasn't there August '07 when I did the BDragon. I am headed there in October and will try to pull some out of there. It looks poorly run and I can't figure out why they ran it anyway?? Hopefully it will be easy to remove.
Sounder wrote:Under normal circumstances, I would never tell another man how to shave his balls... but this device should not be kept secret.

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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Joshua Smith » Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:56 am

Grateful Diver wrote:
Nailer99 wrote:You don't happen to own a boat, by any chance, do you?
:smt027

Uh uh ... been there, done that ... don't ever want to be that broke again ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)


Lol. Yeah, you can quadruple the price of anything, just by putting the word "marine" in front of it.
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Grateful Diver » Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:48 am

Nailer99 wrote:You don't happen to own a boat, by any chance, do you?
:smt027

Uh uh ... been there, done that ... don't ever want to be that broke again ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Joshua Smith » Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:01 am

Grateful Diver wrote:
Nailer99 wrote:
Grateful Diver wrote:What would be the possibility of cleaning up some of the line that's already on there ... so that doesn't happen to somebody else?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)



I've been thinking I should devote some bottom time to that.

Lemme know if you want a dive buddy ... and when you'd be thinking to do it ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)


You don't happen to own a boat, by any chance, do you?
:smt027
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Grateful Diver » Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:13 am

Nailer99 wrote:
Grateful Diver wrote:What would be the possibility of cleaning up some of the line that's already on there ... so that doesn't happen to somebody else?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)



I've been thinking I should devote some bottom time to that.

Lemme know if you want a dive buddy ... and when you'd be thinking to do it ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
Threats and ultimatums are never the best answer. Public humiliation via Photoshop is always better - airsix

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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Joshua Smith » Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:34 am

Grateful Diver wrote:What would be the possibility of cleaning up some of the line that's already on there ... so that doesn't happen to somebody else?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)



I've been thinking I should devote some bottom time to that.
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Grateful Diver » Fri Aug 01, 2008 5:27 am

What would be the possibility of cleaning up some of the line that's already on there ... so that doesn't happen to somebody else?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Romer Treece » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:07 pm

Damn tootin brother!! :axe:

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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Joshua Smith » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:04 pm

Like I said, it worked in cove 2. At least we can try and spread the word. Maybe somewhere, somehow, the people responsible will see the light, and stop doing it. Or not. But at least we tried.
And if they decide to keep doing it, I hope they get so tangled in their own line that they juuuuuuust barely make it back to the surface, and get scared so bad they quit diving.
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Romer Treece » Thu Jul 31, 2008 1:42 pm

Grateful Diver wrote:Unfortunately, what you're running up against is human nature.

Tech diving is becoming increasingly popular ... not to mention increasingly accessible to people who, in past years, wouldn't have been qualified for it. In former years, it was a small community where everybody knew everybody else who was doing it. That's no longer the case. And like any activity, the larger the pool of people doing it, the more likely that you're going to have some participants who are in it strictly for themselves ... and really don't give a crap about how their actions are going to affect others who might want to share the resources.

What happened to the Warren car is a perfect example.

Some of this might be attributable to ignorance ... people who are fairly new at tech diving, and haven't really thought about either the aesthetic or safety damage they're causing with their line. In which case, perhaps the tech instructors might want to consider stressing this a little more during training. But I think for the most part it's just people who don't care, rather than don't know, that what they're doing isn't a good idea for the community as a whole.

You get those types no matter what activity you're engaged in ... and the larger the pool of participants, the more likely you are to run into them ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)



I couldn't agree more! That's why I hope we can make some kind of change by bringing it out to the open on these forums. I don't know maybe that doesn't work, I'm kinda new to this forum arena, but I'd like to hope this public display of what NOT to do could make a change. :violent1: :violent1:

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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Grateful Diver » Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:08 am

Unfortunately, what you're running up against is human nature.

Tech diving is becoming increasingly popular ... not to mention increasingly accessible to people who, in past years, wouldn't have been qualified for it. In former years, it was a small community where everybody knew everybody else who was doing it. That's no longer the case. And like any activity, the larger the pool of people doing it, the more likely that you're going to have some participants who are in it strictly for themselves ... and really don't give a crap about how their actions are going to affect others who might want to share the resources.

What happened to the Warren car is a perfect example.

Some of this might be attributable to ignorance ... people who are fairly new at tech diving, and haven't really thought about either the aesthetic or safety damage they're causing with their line. In which case, perhaps the tech instructors might want to consider stressing this a little more during training. But I think for the most part it's just people who don't care, rather than don't know, that what they're doing isn't a good idea for the community as a whole.

You get those types no matter what activity you're engaged in ... and the larger the pool of participants, the more likely you are to run into them ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by rjw » Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:29 am

BDub wrote:Holy cow! That is ridiculous! What a mess...

I dived the BD on Memorial Day Weekend last year, and I don't remember seeing any line at all.

Makes absolutely no sense to me.


My last trip to the BD was back in April. I was quite surprised to see the amount of line that had been left in the mean time. It was everywhere and seemed to run in all directions.
As I stated in an earlier post this is a small wreck and is shallow enough to allow for some nice BT. Whoever is doing this needs to allow 2-3 min in the dive plan to clean up.
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Romer Treece » Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:17 am

LCF wrote:I don't do this kind of diving at all, but I'm completely confused as to why people would run line and leave it. Isn't the purpose of the line to return to your starting point? Does it get so tangled in the wreck you CAN'T get it back off? And if you cut it, how do you get back to where you started?


I have been doing this kind of diving for a while and I'M bewildered as to why people do this. It doesn't make any sense! ESPECIALLY when the wreck is so small. There is a lot of talk as to how we need to preserve the Lake Wa. wrecks and not disturb them, hell even to keep people off of them if they don't have proper diving techniques, but leaving cave line strewn all over them is ok!!?? :dontknow: :dontknow: PLEASE CLEAN UP YOUR LINE!!
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Joshua Smith
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Joshua Smith » Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:29 am

Given the amount of this stuff on the Lake WA wrecks, I'm convinced that it's a local tech diver (or divers). I don't know what can be done to stop it, short of trying to raise awareness of it, and perhaps shame whoever's doing it into stopping.That seemed to work on the area around the I beams in Cove 2- that used to be a real rat nest of tangled lines, and after enough people complained about it, it got cleaned up. There are quite a few tech divers around here.......but it's still a small world.
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by BDub » Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:16 am

Holy cow! That is ridiculous! What a mess...

I dived the BD on Memorial Day Weekend last year, and I don't remember seeing any line at all.

Makes absolutely no sense to me.
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Re: Black Dragon 7/27/08

Post by Joshua Smith » Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:09 am

LCF wrote:I don't do this kind of diving at all, but I'm completely confused as to why people would run line and leave it. Isn't the purpose of the line to return to your starting point? Does it get so tangled in the wreck you CAN'T get it back off? And if you cut it, how do you get back to where you started?


I agree. It makes no sense. In class, we were taught that if the clock is ticking, and it's time to do your ascent, and you tangle your reel, you cut it, or just leave it there attached to the down line, but you don't waste any time with underwater knot unravelling. But that would be the knot or wrap in the very end of the line- hardly anything at all. Somebody has been leaving hundreds of feet of line all over local wrecks- particularly in Lake Washington. Why, I don't know. Maybe they're getting tangled in the line and having an emergency situation on every single dive they do? Maybe they circumnavigate the wreck running line, get back to their starting point, and just cut it because they don't care?
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