Page 2 of 2

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:22 pm
by BillZ
dlh wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 5:18 pm
Speaking of lithium battery chargers: I've been reading up on this and found that Drones use a particularly volatile battery type called Lithium Polymer. This is different from the Lithium Ion batteries we find in Lights and Cameras. It seems that they are so volatile that there are Dozens of products on Amazon, etc for fireproof charging and storage containers to limit the impact of a charging fire. Do any of our drone enthusiasts know about this?

I'm going to order one of these containers (like a soft side cooler made of fiberglass fabric and foil)[/url] for home & travel use for for my LiON batteries to be extra safe. And never charge any of this stuff when I'm not present and awake...
This^^^^

This is a huge tragedy and we may never know the cause of the fire on the Conception but if some good comes out of this it would be the realization that LiON batteries ARE NOT your run-of-the-mill Duracell. A bit of salt water, unprotected batteries, a problem charger, etc. can all cause LiON batteries to ignite and it's almost impossible to put them out.

A few years ago we were out scootering Alki Fishing Reef from my boat when one of the scooters flooded. We brought the scooter onto to boat and the LiON battery started belching flames. Luckily we saw it soon enough and were able to clip the scooter off to a line and throw it overboard. It "boiled" in the water for 45 minutes as we towed it back to the boat launch.

I've seen it on every live-a-board I've been on... The charging table is full so people plug their chargers into outlets in the salon, galley, their room etc.(I'm guilty of this). After a long dive day many folks leave their batteries charging overnight unattended. I know in light of this tragedy I'll be buying the case Dave posted above and be cautious of where and when I charge my batteries.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:29 pm
by Tangfish
I have those fire cases for individual LiPo drone batteries as they’re required for any batteries not installed in the drone while flying. They are a different kind of battery that is volatile and has a shorter track record than lithium.

Also as much a rip-off as they usually are I never use aftermarket chargers, cables and plugs (okay I have some micro-usb ones I don’t remember where they came from), including for phones. I started doing that after that poor flight attendant died while going to unplug a knockoff iPhone square plug.

Recently some LOBs enacted policies of no battery charging in rooms. I think it’s a good idea.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:12 pm
by H20doctor
Yeah that was my first thought about that situation was charging station had to be the culprit...

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Sat Sep 07, 2019 7:01 pm
by Penopolypants
I'm not surprised by the latest legal proceedings, but that doesn't negate my outrage.

Our house burned down when I was a child, and even as young as I was I remember my parents talking about the fights with the insurance company. Fortunately nobody was hurt, but we did lose everything, and my parents eventually had to sue. This was in the early '80's, so this is by no means a new phenomenon. Few people win in these scenarios, except the attorneys, and I don't blame them, because they are fighting to protect their clients.

This has me thinking hard about many things, but I will reserve my final judgement until the final judgement. Out of all the things we worry about regarding safety when diving, dying in your sleep isn't high on the list. Be safe, y'all.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:21 pm
by stphnmartin

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:25 am
by Penopolypants
Interesting to see that the engine compartment didn't appear to be the source, and it sounds like the crew did all they could.

The only two exits for the berths went into the same area (not news, I know), but that will be something I look for the next time I'm on such a boat.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:03 pm
by stphnmartin
Apparently they were required to have a night watch per their Certificate of Inspection, issued by the Coast Guard.

https://www.apnews.com/f83f169aa80e4deba3d57329943cf3e1

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 11:39 pm
by derekcs

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:14 pm
by stphnmartin

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:38 am
by Penopolypants
Oof. It may be true that a bigger hatch and an exit light wouldn't have helped in the smoke, but it might have helped some.

Also: "...the grandfathering of older vessels often happens when meeting new regulations is economically unfeasible and impractical"

Keep doing things the cheap and easy way. :(

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:23 pm
by Gdog
I'm glad that the end result of this tragedy will most likely end the grandfather clause, and while our trip prices will go up, so will the likelihood of surviving something like this should it happen again. This was the perfect storm, so many factors piled up to produce these deaths. So sad people of our dive community had to die for this to happen.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:59 pm
by Desert Diver
If it ends the grandfather clause there will be no more commercial dive boats.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2019 5:47 pm
by Tangfish
Or those boats will have to be upgraded and the cost of doing so will be passed on to the consumer. I for one would be willing to pay more to go aboard a boat with modern safety precautions in place.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:23 pm
by Desert Diver
Try to imagine cars, buses, houses and business buildings not being grandfathered. The boats would not be upgraded they would be new. Very few would be willing to pay that cost.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:41 am
by Gdog
I hope you are wrong. It may shut some down. Rates will go up for sure. But something had to be done.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 11:33 am
by Tangfish
Buildings are retrofitted with reinforcement structures pretty often, based on ever evolving regulation. If buildings are a guide for boats, there will not just be one modern standard everyone has to conform to but a series of standards established in steps, presumably based on the age and type of boats, the operators of which will have time to reach and stay in compliance with. That they’re discussing this at all is overall a good thing when it comes to preventing the tragedies like what happened to the Conception. But the right balance will have to be reached so that there’s not a drastic overnight change that puts everyone out of business at once.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:08 pm
by Gdog
Well stated

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 9:24 pm
by Desert Diver
I probably should just drop this but I guess I'll go one more. I own a shop built in '77. No one has ever come in and told me to bring it up to code in any way. I live in a house built in '48. Once again, never had anyone tell me it needed code upgrades. We have over 30 rental houses, some built in the '20's. Never a requirement to bring them up to code with the single exception that Washington law does require that rental houses have smoke and CO2 detectors, but not the kind that would be required in new construction. Just simple battery powered detectors that are working when the renters move in.

Re: Truth Aquatics Conception Boat Fire Tragedy

Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2019 11:03 am
by Gdog
Great points, however, if all the bedrooms were in underground basements in these rentals, with one small window for escape, things may look a bit different. I agree it's a double edged sword.