Pony tanks?

[spatz84]

those bottles only give you about 50 or so breaths at the surface. I wonder how deep this cave hes in was, did anyone count the breaths he took? I estimated some where between 15 and 20. (that would be a pretty damm close shave). I carry one of these bottles on my BC for an absolute sudden OOA situation, at recreational dive depths only. I would never in a million years think of that as a backup system for Cave diving. Especially any cave that it takes a scooter to get out of in a hurry!

S.

[Nwbrewer]

those bottles only give you about 50 or so breaths at the surface. I wonder how deep this cave hes in was, did anyone count the breaths he took? I estimated some where between 15 and 20. (that would be a pretty damm close shave). I carry one of these bottles on my BC for an absolute sudden OOA situation, at recreational dive depths only. I would never in a million years think of that as a backup system for Cave diving. Especially any cave that it takes a scooter to get out of in a hurry!

S.

Uhhhh.... Pretty sure the video was a joke....

[spatman]

those bottles only give you about 50 or so breaths at the surface. I wonder how deep this cave hes in was, did anyone count the breaths he took? I estimated some where between 15 and 20. (that would be a pretty damm close shave). I carry one of these bottles on my BC for an absolute sudden OOA situation, at recreational dive depths only. I would never in a million years think of that as a backup system for Cave diving. Especially any cave that it takes a scooter to get out of in a hurry!

S.

Uhhhh.... Pretty sure the video was a joke....

crap. really? i was so impressed with that video i placed an order for 3 SpareAirs as backups on my dive on the Governor next week. the video was so convincing i figured the extra 9cf the 3 units would provide would be more than enough to bail me out after i've penetrated the wreck in search of the Bonny Prince Josh Crown Jewels rumored to be stowed in the toilet tank of the forward head.

i wonder if it's too late to cancel my order.

[Dusty2]

Yep, That guy had doubles and a sling bottle that looked to be an AL80 and he still ran out of air in an overhead environment? Darwin should collect this guy for sure!

[TCWestby]

The way I see it is that the more air you carry the better. si a pony won't get you from 100' to the surface but if you think about it you will have a better chance from wherever you run out of air than from the bottom.

This doesn't imply that a diver should ignore his/ her air co nsumption. My rule of thought though is the more air I carry the better. Hey, I'm in fo an 80cf pony bottle...... and once I get to the point I can afford one I'm adding it to my standard setup. there is no such thing as too many redundancies.

[Mattleycrue76]

there is no such thing as too many redundancies.

[Paulicarp]

there is no such thing as too many redundancies.

Uh...But isn't there a point of diminishing returns? And risk to reward ratio?

[airsix]

The bungied octo through the face-port is an interesting twist.

[Nwbrewer]

The bungied octo through the face-port is an interesting twist.

Whenever someone tells me I'm going to get choked by using a long hose I think about that guy. All the way around the neck is sweet hose routing.

I can't imagine trying to dive with all that crap attached to me.

[Waynne Fowler]

there is no such thing as too many redundancies.

DADDY!!!! Where you been???

[mz53480]

What's the box like thing at the back?

1

wit.JPG (12.63 KiB) Viewed 1739 times

[spatman]

i'm having forum deja vu....

[CaptnJack]

What's the box like thing at the back?

'

He was an early adopter of the POV cam. Seriously I seem to recall that's the VCR part. That guy is famous on the spearo boards...

[Paulicarp]

I carry one of these bottles on my BC for an absolute sudden OOA situation, at recreational dive depths only. I would never in a million years think of that as a backup system for Cave diving.

I don't make any secret of the fact that I have a different take on the whole "Spare Air" debate (which has been hashed over and over in other threads and on other forums). Last week Monday I did notice you carry one, but I didn't get the chance to ask a couple of questions that came to my mind:

1) What do you do to maintain your spare air? Is it one of those pieces of gear that is just always there in case you need it like a whistle or knife or do you refill and check it every time you dive?
2) Do you breathe off it before you descend to know for sure that it is functional?
3) Do you have a gauge on it so you know how much gas is in it?
4) Is the reg rebuildable? How often do you service/rebuild it?
5) If your buddy has an OOA, do you give them the Spare Air?
6) When you do your gas plan, do you factor in the Spare Air or not?


By asking these questions, I don't intend to pick a fight or start a debate over the use of ponies or Spare Airs. Neither am I interested in an argument about for or against; I sincerely want to understand HOW you dive with it since you’ve made the choice to dive with it.

[Joshua Smith]

I carry one of these bottles on my BC for an absolute sudden OOA situation, at recreational dive depths only. I would never in a million years think of that as a backup system for Cave diving.

I don't make any secret of the fact that I have a different take on the whole "Spare Air" debate (which has been hashed over and over in other threads and on other forums). Last week Monday I did notice you carry one, but I didn't get the chance to ask a couple of questions that came to my mind:

1) What do you do to maintain your spare air? Is it one of those pieces of gear that is just always there in case you need it like a whistle or knife or do you refill and check it every time you dive?
2) Do you breathe off it before you descend to know for sure that it is functional?
3) Do you have a gauge on it so you know how much gas is in it?
4) Is the reg rebuildable? How often do you service/rebuild it?
5) If your buddy has an OOA, do you give them the Spare Air?
6) When you do your gas plan, do you factor in the Spare Air or not?


By asking these questions, I don't intend to pick a fight or start a debate over the use of ponies or Spare Airs. Neither am I interested in an argument about for or against; I sincerely want to understand HOW you dive with it since you’ve made the choice to dive with it.

While I'm not a fan of the "spare air", per se (So you can run out of air twice!), I am a big supporter of divers adding the ability to self rescue to their kits. There's absolutely nothing wrong with it. As a single-tank diver, I started slinging a 30 cf stage, and upgraded to a 40 soon after that. I tried many configurations- if anyone is interested, I have one of those deals that lets you mount a pony bottle of any size to your main cylinder. I didn't like it, and I'll sell it cheap. When I saw how easy it was to sling a tank, I started doing it right away. There was no downside- I had an extra 40 cf of air to use, for me or my buddy, right there by my side. Yes, I practiced with it, maintained it, and did drills with it- Calvin and I would sometimes practice buddy breathing with it, while we navigated into the shallows- we would even practice handing it off to each other. I realize that it doesn't fit into the "Team Diving" approach, but early on, I used to dive with a lot of people that I'd never met before. Some of them were not very safe divers. 40 cf of extra gas by my side bought me a lot of "peace of mind."

[spatz84]

those bottles only give you about 50 or so breaths at the surface. I wonder how deep this cave hes in was, did anyone count the breaths he took? I estimated some where between 15 and 20. (that would be a pretty damm close shave). I carry one of these bottles on my BC for an absolute sudden OOA situation, at recreational dive depths only. I would never in a million years think of that as a backup system for Cave diving. Especially any cave that it takes a scooter to get out of in a hurry!

S.

Uhhhh.... Pretty sure the video was a joke....

Hey shit I never know, For all I know that guy might be trying to sell the things. If Some nuby like me sees this vidoe there not going to know if its a joke or not. (well hell apparently I didn't) you guys know this dude or something?

[spatman]

Hey shit I never know, For all I know that guy might be trying to sell the things. If Some nuby like me sees this vidoe there not going to know if its a joke or not. (well hell apparently I didn't) you guys know this dude or something?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChZapfN5s-8

Picture 1.png (23.87 KiB) Viewed 1709 times

[spatz84]

I carry one of these bottles on my BC for an absolute sudden OOA situation, at recreational dive depths only. I would never in a million years think of that as a backup system for Cave diving.

I don't make any secret of the fact that I have a different take on the whole "Spare Air" debate (which has been hashed over and over in other threads and on other forums). Last week Monday I did notice you carry one, but I didn't get the chance to ask a couple of questions that came to my mind:

1) What do you do to maintain your spare air? Is it one of those pieces of gear that is just always there in case you need it like a whistle or knife or do you refill and check it every time you dive?
2) Do you breathe off it before you descend to know for sure that it is functional?
3) Do you have a gauge on it so you know how much gas is in it?
4) Is the reg rebuildable? How often do you service/rebuild it?
5) If your buddy has an OOA, do you give them the Spare Air?
6) When you do your gas plan, do you factor in the Spare Air or not?


By asking these questions, I don't intend to pick a fight or start a debate over the use of ponies or Spare Airs. Neither am I interested in an argument about for or against; I sincerely want to understand HOW you dive with it since you’ve made the choice to dive with it.

Thanks for the interest, I know I have been busted up by the 'Tech Crowd' abit over the use or value of a Spare Air bottle. I got the bottle befor I became a member of this forum. I was finding myself forced to solo because I didn't have buddies. And I felt that I should have some sort of back up. I am also not made of money the larger setups are considerably more money ( second tank, second reg., second hose, ) I also don't like to be over cluttered, I don't like to enter the water for a Recreational Dive looking like 'Optimus Prime' or like I'm out to hunt the Great Kracken like the dude in that last Pic. so for me the issue was $$$, efficency, and specific use. that being said, let me try and answer you questions:

1. yes I do refill and check it every time I dive. it refills right off my main tank, very easy to do.
2. I usually do take a blast on it before I decend but I do admit sometimes I don't but I always test blast it on shore before the dive.
3. there is a small pin gauge on it that tells you if it is full or not.
4. I have only had the device for a short time ( about 8 dives ) so i havn't had to rebuild it yet and I don't know whats involved in doing that yet.
5 No! the Spare Air is not for a buddy only for myself, the regular Octo. is for the Buddy.
6. No I do not factor the spare air into a 'Gas Plan' again I consider this only for Recreational Dive Depths.

I hope that this helps answer some of your questions. I have found that the 'Tech. Crowd' has gained alot of information and become very proficient at what they are doing. However In gaining all that information I think that they often loose perspective. (I know that probably will raise a shit storm on this forum but so be it.) however I am not a TECH. diver, OW 80 fsw or less. I feel that at this depth and type of dive that these small bottles are a viable PERSONAL emrgency backup system. I feel as long as the person understands the perameters for its uses and its [LIMITATIONS]there is nothing wrong with having one of these on or about your rig.

S.

[Dusty2]

I'm a firm believer that everyone should have their own redundant air source. I personally don't think the spare air is enough but if I was at 50 feet and OOA I'm sure I would be glad to have it. They are small, compact, and easy to deploy so why not.

Buddy diving is great but ultimately the only person you can really depend on in that once in a lifetime situation is yourself. No matter how close your buddy sticks to you there will be times that you lose contact or that he is looking the wrong way or some other situation where you can't get to him fast enough. I for one know what it's like to inhale and get nothing. You can't hold your breath long with empty lungs. If you have a free flow when your low on air your octo isn't going to do you much good.

I always carry a 30cfm pony and the reg on my necklace is my pony not my octo. I would not dive with out it even if I really trusted the person I was with. This is a personal choice and I'm sure others will disagree but it's My choice and I CAN live with it.

As for the Spare air being cheaper..... Not, It is easy to set up a pony for the same money as a spare air if you shop around.

[Mattleycrue76]

Acually I have found that this forum is pretty well behaved (for the most part) thanks to the fact that we all dive together You will find differences of opinion, after all that's what a discussion board is for, what you won't find is name calling attitudes of I am better than you because.....
While I have my reasons for not being a fan of the spare air I applaud you for thinking about redundancy this early in your diving career. Over time you may change your opinion and perspective or you may not. As long as you have the right attitude I'll dive with you any day.

No shitstorm here.

[Paulicarp]

We have different philosophies of diving and I hold my convictions as strongly as you hold yours, but you’ll get no shit storm from me. (maybe a good natured once in a while) I need buddies as much as you do, (probably more than you do since I don’t have a spare air) and I just want to know what to expect and what to be able to rely on when I dive with you.

Having said that, I think Dusty makes a couple of good points that I agree with:

1)I don’t think 3 cuft is enough. Whatever way you do your SCUBA math, it’s a very small quantity of gas to qualify as a “redundant air source.”

2)It is easy to set up a pony for the same money as a spare air if you shop around, and the benefits are many: larger gas capacity, more reliable regulator, more accurate SPG, standard equipment can be interchanged and reconfigured if your style of diving changes or you need to change your gear configuration around for some reason. (a small pony bottle could become an argon bottle or a larger pony could become a stage/deco bottle, etc) (O rings, regs, hoses, etc. are interchangeable and therefore are resources for you AND your buddies in a pinch)


In any event, I hope to see ya Monday night!

[Dashrynn]

Don't try this at home, it's the new and improved Spare Air for DIR. Notice the protocol when using a pony is to NOT clip off your second stage- you never know when you might need it back!
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChZapfN5 ... r_embedded#[/youtube]

i want the red scooter....

[Nwbrewer]

Don't try this at home, it's the new and improved Spare Air for DIR. Notice the protocol when using a pony is to NOT clip off your second stage- you never know when you might need it back!
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChZapfN5 ... r_embedded#[/youtube]

i want the red scooter....

Pretty sure dive-X standard used to make them that color, (yellow too?) so they are out there, just have to find one.

[CaptnJack]

Guys that's a Tekna, precursor to the Mako. Hasn't been made in about 15yrs although you can still find them used. Rewound they can actually be pretty fast. But they are leaky and while that's not the end of the world in freshwater its disasterous in saltwater.

DiveXtras can have a X scooter powder coated any color you want. I can imagine Dash with a dapper pink one :luv:

[spatz84]

We have different philosophies of diving and I hold my convictions as strongly as you hold yours, but you’ll get no shit storm from me. (maybe a good natured once in a while) I need buddies as much as you do, (probably more than you do since I don’t have a spare air) and I just want to know what to expect and what to be able to rely on when I dive with you.

Having said that, I think Dusty makes a couple of good points that I agree with:

1)I don’t think 3 cuft is enough. Whatever way you do your SCUBA math, it’s a very small quantity of gas to qualify as a “redundant air source.”

2)It is easy to set up a pony for the same money as a spare air if you shop around, and the benefits are many: larger gas capacity, more reliable regulator, more accurate SPG, standard equipment can be interchanged and reconfigured if your style of diving changes or you need to change your gear configuration around for some reason. (a small pony bottle could become an argon bottle or a larger pony could become a stage/deco bottle, etc) (O rings, regs, hoses, etc. are interchangeable and therefore are resources for you AND your buddies in a pinch)


In any event, I hope to see ya Monday night!

You know this is wierd, I have heard others say the same thing. but if a diver is at 70ft down and has a sudden OOA situation do you not think that the diver could make the surface with 20 breaths available to him/her? I know for myself if I have an E-situation I will not be hanging around to trouble shoot the deal, buddie or no buddie, And for myself there is no question in my mind that,FROM THAT DEPTH, I could make top side with that many breaths. for myself, with that many breaths I could (from 70- ) make the surface nice and easy even. Or make sure I got to my buddie or they got to me. I realize that for dives that would require a decompression stop that this bottle would not work (know the limetations) But I am curiouse as to why so many people feel that for a recreational dive depth, 60 ft or less ( I push that alittle deeper I admit) that this system would not provide enough air, I am a fairly new diver so I'm honestly interested in knowing what those of you more advanced folkes know that I'm am missing in this scenario?

No arguements here just truely interested to know.

S.