Extended Range Diving

[Joshua Smith]

The Rouses inevitably come up as an example in these types of discussion. One thing nobody ever talks about is the strained dynamic of their relationship. For those that haven't read it, "The Last Dive" is an amazing, incredible book, and ought to be required reading for anyone looking at tech diving.

I'm of the opinion that they shouldn't have been diving together at all- they pushed each other into dangerous territory all the time; and Chrissy, the son, seemed to have a kind of Attention Defecit problem. When you look at the bigger picture and consider their personalities, it's hard for me to say that breathing air is what killed them- mix might have made a crucial difference in their case, but it might not have, too. (Personally, I wouldn't have done what they did on air, but I wasn't there, either.)

[Pez7378]

I've been to 130 on air. I didn't like it. I probably won't do it again.

I believe that Panic is what Killed the Rouses plain and simple. Diving Deep on air, Greed, collapse, a lost deco bottle and exiting in the wrong direction led up to the panic. If I remember right, Chris had plenty of gas, Chrissy was dangerously low when he exited the sub.

[Grateful Diver]

haha i'm 123

No shit? I went to high school in Exit 125 (Edison) ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[defied]

who on this board was even diving 16 years ago?

What's 32 -14... *click click on Calculator*.... 18.

I was. 0]

Granted I was 14, and never went past 100FSW until I was 17.

I guess I'm not asking if the Rouses were certified to deep air (allthough good to know), I was just wondering out loud if that had any relevance to Chattertons frame of mind on this.

Didn't mean to bring them up directly, more to bring up Chatterton's history of death in his diving groups.

D(B)

[CaptnJack]

I've been to 130 on air. I didn't like it. I probably won't do it again.

Ditto. I would do 130ft on air if I'm not in an overhead and the vis was "not Puget Sound/Lake WA". Of course the deco limits are silly short. But for any kind of overhead diving (cave, wreck, deco) there is no way I am going to stack the deck against myself and my buddies by knowingly and intentionally diving impaired.

ENDs greater than 130ft were a significant contributor to many cave diving depths in the past. Its interesting to note that there is no such thing as "cave extended range"

Although only one in ten cave diving fatalities involves certified cave or cavern divers, 90 percent of these fatalities take place on dives in which participants expose themselves to an Equivalent Narcotic Depth (END) of 130 feet or more.

http://www.cavediving.com/how/5_rules/04.htm

[Nwbrewer]

I've been to 130 on air. I didn't like it. I probably won't do it again.

Why, you don't like watching Joe wander off into oblivion wondering where the hell he's going as you look at the boat at Mukilteo, wondering why the hell you bothered to come all the way down there to see an empty boat?

I've been to 130 on slightrox, I'd do it again if there was something worth looking at down there and I had a slope with stuff to see as I continued to shallower water. But it's not something I'm going to do just to go deep. About 110 is the edge of where I like to be narc wise.

[Bric Martin]

I just got home from work and have now read through this thread. I missed a great discussion today. I am in the process of making some decisions about my diving direction . For me this thread was great. At some point I did a search on the net and came across something about a Tech diving seminar here in the Northwest. Are there any plans for something like this to happen again?

Bric

[CaptnJack]

I just got home from work and have now read through this thread. I missed a great discussion today. I am in the process of making some decisions about my diving direction . For me this thread was great. At some point I did a search on the net and came across something about a Tech diving seminar here in the Northwest. Are there any plans for something like this to happen again?

Bric

That wreck symposium was a "one-off" organized by Peo and (someone else, Sharps maybe?). Both are on this board but they aren't regulars. You might ask them: Peo Orvendal and John Sharps

[Scott]

Gotta agree with the ol' gray beard folks. Most of my diving after I got my OW was military diving and it was a long time ago but it definately made you think about where you were and what was happening around you. I do a fair amount of 125+' diving and I find some days it is a lot more comfortable than others. Without the experience, which you get from diving the borderline a lot, I don't think a person can tell when it is uncomfortable enough to call the dive. That borderline will go away with an ascent of a few feet- most of the time.

[Gill Envy]

John, great post! I'll give you some green on RBW :-)

I suppose i'm one of those atypical folks, I did not follow anyone else's pattern, then again, maybe that is more common than is supposed. I did something like 700 air dives, some of them well below recreational limits before ever taking a nitrox class and then only because it was a pre-req for CCR diving. I don't think of myself as a shining example of conservatism nor do I think I am that fool hardy, but then again everyone likes to think of themselves as balanced. Three years into CCR diving and I still have not gotten around to a trimix course, though I have pushed the depths a bit here and there beyond what one would "recommend". Am I an idiot? Who knows, everyone has to draw their own line with these things based on what their experience, tolerances and comfort zone is. There's nothing to prove and I see no value in pointing fingers.

My feeling is that under the right circumstances it can be very valuable to "see through the looking glass" of narcosis and learn how you respond under a variety of mental/emotional dynamics with it... within reason of course. Dare I say I even enjoy getting narced on occasion? I'll certainly admit that i've had my brain turn to noodles and the goblins come out of their cages and in not so fun ways at times. It's not that I recommend it but having a few brushes with narcosis has me tempted to think that having these experiences in a controlled environment for brief periods has saved my but the few times it has come to real live sh*t hitting the fan.

there is a whole other side to this as well. Helium is a finite resource, the planet is running out of it. Some estimates suggest we will run out in a few decades at current consumption rates. Even now many of the places I've been diving in the last few years are simply too remote to get it. one has to wonder, what are we going to do when we run out of Helium. What do you do when it's not available, stay above 100 ft? I doubt it.

I've found that my comfort zone with diving CCR air dilluent maxes out with brief diversions to 165 FSW, my max was around 140fsw on OC air. My curiosity for going deeper will likely lead me to trimix in the near future. for now, i'm pretty happy doing what i'm doing. I do wish there was a CCR MOD 1.5, that dealt with decompression and bail out planning for moderate deep diving on air diluent, I think it's valuable to learn how to do safely, since there will undoubtedly be more times when helium is just not available and I am called to "go a little deeper". I'm guessing that moderate range deep CCR diving is going to become more common as more recreational divers go directly into CCR diving without doing trimix first and nature adhors a void, someone is bound to come up with a training course to fill the niche, while many scoff.