Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

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ljjames
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby ljjames » Tue May 22, 2018 1:37 am

YellowEye wrote:Hi
Good thread. I have a buddy who has taken up the following body position. They dive with F1's. Any insights on if a weight shift would help get the knees up more? If so, weights lower down or higher up? Thanks!!

body.jpg


It’s often easier on lower back to drop knees. (Meaning it may not always be a balanced gear thing)
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BillZ
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby BillZ » Mon May 21, 2018 11:21 pm

Dropping the knees is typically a sign of light feet. Try having your buddy shifting his tak down (BC up). Small adjustments of in inch or less is all it usually takes.

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby YellowEye » Mon May 21, 2018 2:57 pm

Hi
Good thread. I have a buddy who has taken up the following body position. They dive with F1's. Any insights on if a weight shift would help get the knees up more? If so, weights lower down or higher up? Thanks!!

body.jpg
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johndo88
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby johndo88 » Mon May 21, 2018 1:08 pm

CaptnJack wrote:good call!

+1 for the Holis F1 fins.

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dwashbur
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby dwashbur » Sat May 19, 2018 7:37 am

Another vote for tank and weight placement. My daughter used to wear 5 pounds of ankle weight on each foot because her feet were so floaty. Some advice from a very smart person led us to adjust her tank and her weight harness down several inches, and she was able to eliminate the ankle weights altogether.
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby BillZ » Fri May 18, 2018 9:23 pm

The real solution is to just buy a scooter - you'll never have to worry about those pesky fins again!

Just kidding (well sort of..) . I dove floaty atomic split fins for years - making adjustments to your tank and weight placement really helps. If your boots are too big fin keepers can help prevent too much air from collecting in your boots. The Hollis F1's are great fin (I own a pair) but so are the Jets and turtles. I mostly dive a pair of HOG Tech 2 fins now - they are a bit lighter than the F1's and have a great side profile for turns an back-kicks.

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby CaptnJack » Fri May 18, 2018 9:20 am

good call!
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby carlk3 » Tue May 15, 2018 4:28 pm

(I'm the original poster)

Thanks for the tips. They worked!

I moved 10 lbs from my trim pockets (about half way up my back) to my dump pockets (at my waist). That did the trick. (Indeed, I may move a little weight back).

Somewhat independently of this, I'm also considering replacing my neutral split fins for heavy Hollis F1's. That should let me lighten/remove my ankle weights.

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby Penopolypants » Fri May 04, 2018 10:45 am

We're postponing the dive anyway, but next time, let me know!
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby carlk3 » Fri May 04, 2018 9:39 am

(I'm the original poster)

Thanks for all the tips!

Penopolypants, I can't make the dive tomorrow, but I very much appreciate the offer of first-hand help. For now, I'll see what my buddy and I can figure out.

- Carl

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby Penopolypants » Tue May 01, 2018 12:34 pm

Carl, if you can make it to the club dive this weekend I can try to find you a less floaty pair of fins to dive with. Everyone here is correct, though, that it's mostly incremental adjustments to weight, technique, and practice over more gear.
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby ljjames » Tue May 01, 2018 11:56 am

+1000 for what CaptJack says. Find a good mentor or instructor who can help you dial things in. It took me a few tries, but once I found someone who helped me do this to my tanks it was like night and day. Quote from that day: "Your trim is good but you are workin' way way way to hard for it". He dropped my tanks and boom! effortless. (this was after 2 decades of diving, thinking i mostly had things sussed out, proof that even old dogs can learn new tricks) For another person that day who was wearing very tail light 72's he dropped her tanks AND put a tail weight, and same result.

Balance your kit: drop your tanks (loosen your shoulder straps, tighten your crotch strap if you are in BP/W), flip your v-weight so it has more weight on the bottom if you are diving dubs, roll with a tail weight if you are diving tail light tanks, lower your weight belt with a harness or pouch near boot of tank. Once you do some of this, you won't feel like you are falling ass over teakettle if you stop moving and suddenly 'in trim' is far more comfortable and feet won't feel 'floaty' even with air in them :)

Think about the heavy parts of your kit and where they are placed on your back. That nice big chunk of brass (regulator first stage) right behind your head has negative buoyancy, so it is technically 'pushing your head down', The base of many (more modern) tanks are heavy, where your waist/weight system is placed will also make a a difference. the further up all that 'heavy' is on your upper body, the more leverage it has, and therefor the lighter your feet will feel.
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby Gdog » Tue May 01, 2018 8:00 am

Pretty much +1 to what has been said. I started with ankle weights for exactly the reasons you are. Over time, as I learned to correct my weighting and trim, and moved away from a very positively buoyant fin, I found I no longer needed them, and when I removed them my trim improved. I also have the attached Yukon boots, and I like them. Work with your weight and tank positioning. Proper trim does initially feel like you are tipped forward with floaty feet a bit. Best advice? Keep diving, make adjustments until you achieve good trim. And by the way, I used ankle weights for the first 5 years or so of diving. There's nothing wrong with using them. But if you can get your adjustments made, you will greatly increase your underwater efficiency with less drag, essentially making a smaller hole as you kick thru the water with less effort. Keep working at it.

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby Jeff Pack » Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:17 pm

You went from a nice form fitting drysuit, to one that isnt and traps more air in places. You'll need to experiment with tank placement and lead to get balanced out.
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby CaptnJack » Mon Apr 30, 2018 4:18 pm

carlk3 wrote:(I'm the original poster)

My dive buddy thinks she may have seen people with straps around their boots to (we presume) lessen the boot volume.
Has anyone heard of this?


They smush down DUI turbo soles which are like a sock with a flat sole glued on the bottom. They wont squish out the air of the Yukon boots.
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby jpa » Mon Apr 30, 2018 4:13 pm

All that stuff is good but Atomic split fins are like life preservers. I had them and they were annoyingly floaty.

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby Penopolypants » Mon Apr 30, 2018 4:08 pm

Yep, they're called fin keepers.
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby carlk3 » Mon Apr 30, 2018 4:02 pm

(I'm the original poster)

My dive buddy thinks she may have seen people with straps around their boots to (we presume) lessen the boot volume.
Has anyone heard of this?

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby CaptnJack » Mon Apr 30, 2018 9:28 am

It might seem counterintuitive but your tank and BC and where you're carrying your lead actually plays a big part in what your feet feel like. "Heavy heavy" is really just another way of saying "feet light". So I would look at everything. 2lbs at the end of your legs is a HUGE amount of mass to move around with every kick, they also put your feet in the silt when you stop kicking (you might not think they are but dollars for donuts your legs probably sink a lot). The other factor to consider is what you perceive is not necessarily accurate. A lot of people think their trim is good and flat - yet they're a good 40degrees from flat. Any chance you can work with a good instructor or DM? I bet you don't need the ankle weights and can probably fix your floaty feeling feet by moving lead around and understanding how you are actually oriented in the water from some video feedback.
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby Diverdave68 » Sun Apr 29, 2018 6:37 pm

Thank you. I said the wrong word. Negative fins, is what I ment.

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby fmerkel » Sun Apr 29, 2018 6:28 pm

Positive fins? He already has floaty feet.
One of the reasons seriously negative fins are used around here is for this problem.

Attached boots inherently "can" have more float than 'rock boots'. But they are warmer (warm air can migrate into the boot) and less hassle. It's a choice. Personally my preference.
Whether you end up with floaty feet depends on a number of factors. Some of the ways of dealing with it have been suggested. Ankle weights are the easiest, and cost the most in terms of energy expenditure. You are still moving mass every time you kick even if it is weightless underwater. Do what you gotta do to trim out. Sometimes it's just getting used to the way a new suit trims out. You are part of the equation, the biggest part.
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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby Diverdave68 » Sun Apr 29, 2018 6:17 pm

So, I'm not a fan of ankle weights. Adjusting your tank and weight belt are my way of dealing with correct plane. Fins; try positive fins. My 2 cents. BTW, I love my nice warm Bare boots.

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Re: Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby GearHead » Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:25 pm

Try putting less air in your suit and more in the BC.

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Attached Drysuit Boots Cause Floaty Feet?

Postby carlk3 » Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:08 pm

Greetings,

I just got a DUI Yukon drysuit with boots attached. I love the convenience, but my feet feel much floatier.
Is this expected? Should I just add more ankle weights?

Details:
Before: White Fusion Fit Drysuit, with separate boots.
Current fins are Atomic split fins, which are considered light.
Currently wearing 2lbs x 2 ankle weights.

Thanks,
Carl


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