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What CCR and Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:03 pm
by Mattleycrue76
Just got back from drooling over all the cool rebreathers at the dive expo. I'm gonna sign up for the Poll workshop through silent scuba and see what this business is all about.
In the mean time I'm curious why you chose the unit that you did? What were the determening factors? And if you had to make the purchase again today what if anything would you do differently?
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:18 pm
by Joshua Smith
Mattleycrue76 wrote:Just got back from drooling over all the cool rebreathers at the dive expo. I'm gonna sign up for the Poll workshop through silent scuba and see what this business is all about.
In the mean time I'm curious why you chose the unit that you did? What were the determening factors? And if you had to make the purchase again today what if anything would you do differently?
Tough topic. All I can really tell you about is why I chose a Megalodon.
-I tried one in the pool at the rebreather experience 2 years ago. I liked it there- but I have to warn you: There is NO WAY to really get a feel for a rebreather in one short pool dive. Or one long pool dive, for that matter. But it felt pretty good in the water to me, or at least better than the other units I tried.
-I was told that it had a very good, tough build quality, and it does. I've been told that I can be a little rough on gear, and it's true. But the Meg is built like a piece of military-grade diving equipment. "Robust" is an understatement. I love this about the Meg.
-I made friends and dive buddies with a group of guys that were all diving Megs, and all of them loved their Megs. I'll dive with just about anyone, as long as we get along, and I don't care what kind of equipment they're using- it doesn't have to be exactly like mine, open circuit is fine, I really don't care, as long as it's safe. But it IS pretty cool to get tips and pointers from a bunch of guys who know the ins and outs of the unit better than you do.
- The factory is about an hour and a half South of me, in Centralia. Plus, I know the GM. If I need something, I can call Jerry and ask for it- small parts and widgets usually show up at my doorstep the next day.
-The more I learn about other CCRs, the more I like my Meg. But you will hear every CCR diver say the same thing about their unit- most of us are horribly biased.
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:35 pm
by Mattleycrue76
Yeah I've been noticing that. FWIW the Meg is definitly the most badass looking one. The other one that looked very interesting to me was the Revo.
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:50 pm
by Joshua Smith
Mattleycrue76 wrote:Yeah I've been noticing that. FWIW the Meg is definitly the most badass looking one. The other one that looked very interesting to me was the Revo.
I gotta say, the rEvo is an interesting unit. I don't know much about it, but if you contact Curt and Mel, they will talk your ear off about them.
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 10:15 pm
by camerone
I think the short answer is that "none of them is perfect," so you figure out the weaknesses of the various units, select one, and dive around its limitations... or you solve the problem and just get a couple of different units for different reasons...not that I would know anything about that answer, although I bow to Mel and Curt. I think the only one she hasn't owned was an old-skool Electrolung
Of the units I've tried/dove or disassembled, I like my Evolution in particular, but only because in the eCCR world right now I think it's got the best factory electronics package out there. There's lots I hate about it, too, but when it comes down to it, you have to kind of pick what you assume is the best core (controller, and potentially scrubber) and work around the rest.
That said, I found the flame red Meg Pathfinder "prototype"/"demo" with the little 6cf bottles and integrated valves sitting on the table at the Expo seriously cool. I think it'd be an awesome "tropical" travel rig for those places where you're stuck with a bunch of tourists hoovering AL80s and all you're going to get all day is a grand total of two hours of BT if you're first in, first out, It'd carry-on in a duffel bag with a nice kydex plate, small wing, and all.
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:50 am
by Curt McNamee
Joshua Smith wrote:Mattleycrue76 wrote:Yeah I've been noticing that. FWIW the Meg is definitly the most badass looking one. The other one that looked very interesting to me was the Revo.
I gotta say, the rEvo is an interesting unit. I don't know much about it, but if you contact Curt and Mel, they will talk your ear off about them.
You can test drive the Meg and the rEvo at our CCR Experience coming up on June 14th :-)
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:05 pm
by defied
Curt McNamee wrote:
You can test drive the Meg and the rEvo at our CCR Experience coming up on June 14th :-)
Aroo?
D(B)
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:03 pm
by Mattleycrue76
Curt McNamee wrote:Joshua Smith wrote:Mattleycrue76 wrote:Yeah I've been noticing that. FWIW the Meg is definitly the most badass looking one. The other one that looked very interesting to me was the Revo.
I gotta say, the rEvo is an interesting unit. I don't know much about it, but if you contact Curt and Mel, they will talk your ear off about them.
You can test drive the Meg and the rEvo at our CCR Experience coming up on June 14th :-)
Yeah I'm gonna try and go to that, sounds like a blast.
You know it's funny whenever I talk to rebreather divers not only do none of them regret going CCR. It seems like none of them regret their choice of unit either. Pretty loyal crowd if you ask me
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:24 pm
by Curt McNamee
Actually, rebreather owners are so proud of their choice that even if what they picked was the wrong unit or there is a better unit currently available, they will most always promote what they have :smt038 .
I am not any different because
I do own the best unit and it is a
rEvo 
the most awesome CCR currently available
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:43 pm
by Tangfish
Curt McNamee wrote:
I am not any different because
I do own the best unit and it is a
rEvo the most awesome CCR currently available
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:19 pm
by Joshua Smith
Curt McNamee wrote:Actually, rebreather owners are so proud of their choice that even if what they picked was the wrong unit or there is a better unit currently available, they will most always promote what they have :smt038 .
I am not any different because
I do own the best unit and it is a
rEvo the most awesome CCR currently available
Curt's right- the Revo is an awesome unit. Do they plan on coming out with a model for men, too Curt?
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:37 pm
by Curt McNamee
I know, all the heavy stainless steel, slim efficeint design, built in redundancy, minimum failure points, unique conservative scrubber design that promotes CO2 safety with one of the best proven WOB's and is no hands down the easiest to clean and maintain in the industry is a total distraction from it's male attraction and that is exactly why I own one :smt038 I am man enough to see it for what it is, I love my rEvo :luv: .
Meg's are good also, we have a couple of each at our house
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 4:24 pm
by Tangfish
.... milk out nose....
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 6:02 pm
by Curt McNamee
Can't take it can you, the truth really, really hurts doesn't it
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 6:22 pm
by John Rawlings
Sigh.....and if you ever want to discuss how REAL divers do it, I'd be happy to talk about my KISS CCR with you. :luv:
The name says it all - Keep It Super Simple. I'm not "Joe-Mechanic" but I like to understand how my CCR works and why. I do NOT like to have to spend enormous amounts of time tweaking and maintaining at the end of the day's diving, (my camera system provides me enough of that!). Easily repaired in the field, and with many parts available at local hardware stores or REI
Rugged, locally made (BC), simple, does the job and does it well. Nuff Sed.
You are fortunate to be diving at a time when so many fine CCRs are readily available on the market.
- John
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 6:24 pm
by Mattleycrue76
Curt McNamee wrote:I know, all the heavy stainless steel, slim efficient design, built in redundancy, minimum failure points, unique conservative scrubber design that promotes CO2 safety with one of the best proven WOB's and is no hands down the easiest to clean and maintain in the industry is a total distraction from it's male attraction and that is exactly why I own one :smt038 I am man enough to see it for what it is, I love my rEvo :luv: .
Meg's are good also, we have a couple of each at our house
It appeared to me that looking at an apples to apples configuration electronics wise that the revo was considerably less expensive than the meg. Am I mistaken?
Or do the Meg guys have a surcharge for the badass corporate logo and the sexy apparel?
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:41 pm
by Curt McNamee
Mattleycrue76 wrote:Curt McNamee wrote:I know, all the heavy stainless steel, slim efficient design, built in redundancy, minimum failure points, unique conservative scrubber design that promotes CO2 safety with one of the best proven WOB's and is no hands down the easiest to clean and maintain in the industry is a total distraction from it's male attraction and that is exactly why I own one :smt038 I am man enough to see it for what it is, I love my rEvo :luv: .
Meg's are good also, we have a couple of each at our house
It appeared to me that looking at an apples to apples configuration electronics wise that the revo was considerably less expensive than the meg. Am I mistaken?
The rEvo, Copis Meg and Kiss Classic are all about the same price based on them being configured as Manual Rebreathers.
Or do the Meg guys have a surcharge for the badass corporate logo and the sexy apparel?
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:43 pm
by Curt McNamee
John Rawlings wrote:Sigh.....and if you ever want to discuss how REAL divers do it, I'd be happy to talk about my KISS CCR with you. :luv:
The name says it all - Keep It Super Simple. I'm not "Joe-Mechanic" but I like to understand how my CCR works and why. I do NOT like to have to spend enormous amounts of time tweaking and maintaining at the end of the day's diving, (my camera system provides me enough of that!). Easily repaired in the field, and with many parts available at local hardware stores or REI
Rugged, locally made (BC), simple, does the job and does it well. Nuff Sed.
You are fortunate to be diving at a time when so many fine CCRs are readily available on the market.
- John
Remember John, I loved my KISS for over 5 yrs and it is also a very good rebreather :luv:
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:52 pm
by cardiver
Curt McNamee wrote:John Rawlings wrote:Sigh.....and if you ever want to discuss how REAL divers do it, I'd be happy to talk about my KISS CCR with you. :luv:
The name says it all - Keep It Super Simple. I'm not "Joe-Mechanic" but I like to understand how my CCR works and why. I do NOT like to have to spend enormous amounts of time tweaking and maintaining at the end of the day's diving, (my camera system provides me enough of that!). Easily repaired in the field, and with many parts available at local hardware stores or REI
Rugged, locally made (BC), simple, does the job and does it well. Nuff Sed.
You are fortunate to be diving at a time when so many fine CCRs are readily available on the market.
- John
Remember John, I loved my KISS for over 5 yrs and it is also a very good rebreather :luv:
OR......Keep it Simple Stupid as they say in the military.
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 8:22 pm
by ljjames
Mattleycrue76 wrote:
It appeared to me that looking at an apples to apples configuration electronics wise that the revo was considerably less expensive than the meg. Am I mistaken?
a COPIS meg is not that different in price from the revo, at least at the prices listed on the revo websites. COPIS megs start around 6500 range (if you already have your bp/w, a little less if you get just the CCR part and supply your own high and low pressure hoses/cylinders) and top out in the eCCR (APECS) with all the bells and whistles at over 10k. (though, fwiw still less than some of the other eCCR units on the market)
The Pathfinder meg (the recreational meg, build around a smaller canister) will likely be coming in at a couple grand less. It won't be as modular as it's big brothers (different plenum/head size than the rest of the family)- but you will be able to use your loop, counterlung, wings, backplate, etc... if you are looking for a sweet little travel kit or a 'starter' CCR. (the mini-meg, cave meg, standard meg - eCCR or mCCR, radial or axial scrubber, your choice, same plenum/head diameter so almost infinitely up or down grade-able, and Leon is always coming up with more options)
Classes I imagine are about the same for both units.
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 8:50 pm
by airsix
Mattleycrue76 wrote:
Or do the Meg guys have a surcharge for the badass corporate logo and the sexy apparel?
Please.
Please, in the name of all good things left in the world.
Stop posting that picture.
When Laura first made mention of that article of clothing it created in my mind an image.
It was a pleasant image.
That image has been destroyed. Probably forever.
In it's place there is now a ghoulish nightmare.
(Nothing personal, Chris.)
:angry:
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 8:57 pm
by Joshua Smith
airsix wrote:That image has been destroyed. Probably forever.
In it's place there is now a ghoulish nightmare.
:angry:
Happens to all of us, sooner or later. It's called "life", son. The sooner you accept it and move on, the better.
Must say, though: that particular piece of clothing looks way, way better on my wife than it does on Pez.
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 10:30 pm
by LCF
Matt, you might enjoy reading a couple of articles:
http://www.uwjournal.com/issues/archive/UWJ-issue3.pdf has one on rebreathers for sport divers by Doug Ebersole, and
http://www.uwjournal.com/issues/archive/UWJ-Issue6.pdf has a lovely long article on a wide variety of the rebreathers which are available, with a brief description of their design, and how the authors see the pluses and minuses of each unit. Even though I am not in the market for a rebreather, I found the articles very interesting reading.
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 6:10 am
by ljjames
everyone... to some degree... is in the market for a rebreather... whether they admit to it or not is another thing
Re: What CCR and Why?
Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 6:24 am
by John Rawlings
Those are some great articles, Lynne! Doug is an excellent photographer and writer, and he describes each of the various CCR units available extremely well. By the way, the Titan CCR (which we first saw at DEMA 2006 and Doug mentions as not yet released in his article) was on display at the Tacoma Dive Expo this past weekend. The Titan has been field-tested by Tom Mount and Jeff Bozanic (along with several others) and apparently orders are now being taken. Still another option available for divers considering a CCR.....
- John