can light can on the right side - nhz

[spatman]

so norris asked me earlier today why the can light is worn on the right when the light head is held in the left hand. i took a guess and said that i thought it was for a cleaner cord routing across the body.

am i off base? what's the evolution of why the light is configured this way?

[CaptnJack]

so norris asked me earlier today why the can light is worn on the right when the light head is held in the left hand. i took a guess and said that i thought it was for a cleaner cord routing across the body.

am i off base? what's the evolution of why the light is configured this way?

most everything comes back to the long hose being on the right post - the only post which cannot roll off on the ceiling of a cave and shut off the gas which has been donated to your buddy.

So if the long hose is on the right post, you need to have a way to secure a 7ft hose when its stowed, the canister does the job.

The light is more commonly (but not always) in the left hand to accomodate a scooter in the right hand. If you don't have a scooter its fairly common to use a temporary hold (hand on top and down on the lighthead) to hold the light. "Not blinding your buddy when you donate the long hose" is a massively overhyped internet reason to <only> have the light in the left hand. I probably swim along with my light under my right hand 40% of the time.

[Sockmonkey]

It took Richard 14 minutes to sense a great disturbance in the DIR force to answer that questions. As if a million NWDC users cried out in AIR2 terror and then were suddenly silenced.

"There's a nw team diver somewhere who has a question... Bdub! To the NWDCmobile!"

What does NHZ mean?

-Eric
(yes that makes Brian boy wonder)

[Grateful Diver]

What does NHZ mean?

-Eric

It's a polite way of requesting that the topic be kept on-topic ... as if anyone at NWDC would ever hijack a conversation ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[Nwbrewer]

"Not blinding your buddy when you donate the long hose" is a massively overhyped internet reason to <only> have the light in the left hand.

You should tell my instructor that, not blinding your buddy was the reason I was given for canlight in left hand during AOW class.....

[spatman]

thanks for the explanation, richard.

I probably swim along with my light under my right hand 40% of the time.

i find i do the same thing as well. glad i'm not endangering anyone by doing it. :biggrin:

[Penopolypants]

It took Richard 14 minutes to sense a great disturbance in the DIR force to answer that questions. As if a million NWDC users cried out in AIR2 terror and then were suddenly silenced.

"There's a nw team diver somewhere who has a question... Bdub! To the NWDCmobile!"

[CaptnJack]

"Not blinding your buddy when you donate the long hose" is a massively overhyped internet reason to <only> have the light in the left hand.

You should tell my instructor that, not blinding your buddy was the reason I was given for canlight in left hand during AOW class.....

More like using up some of the 200 inch cord you got on that thing to avoid your own strangulation!

Lighthead if left hand is fine, its fine in a <temporary> hold in your right as well. I would not put the goodman on my right hand for the reasons you were given.

The "temporary hold" grips the tube part of the lighthead with a downward facing right hand leaving the goodman part empty. Works fine.

[BDub]

In addition to what Richard said about the right post, keep in mind that consistency is a major part of the dir/utd philosophy...consistency in team, gear and training.

From the training and equipment aspects, if you start with the end in mind and work down, you'll never have to change or relearn anything. You're simply adding to the foundation you've already built. Likewise, you don't have to change gear configurations for rec dives to tech dives to cave dives. Sure, you may add stuff like a deco or stage bottle or doubles, depending on need, but the the core equipment is all the same.

The "end" being scootering in an overhead.

If you're triggering with your right hand the light is in your left hand, aside from temporary holds. The cord length is just long enough to go from your right hip, across your torso, and to your left hand. Like Spatty said, the routing is clean this way.

If the canister was on your left hip, and you keep the light head in your left hand, the cord would still have to be long enough to hold it in your right hand for temporary holds. In other words, when the light is in your left hand (which is most of the time), the cord would be too long and have excess slack hanging down. Not ideal when scootering in an overhead. Only when it was in the right hand would the cord be routed clean, with no excess slack.

Plus, you don't want to blind your ooa buddy

[dsteding]

Not to mention having stage/deco bottles on the left side.

Richard, Brian, you guys are getting slow, figured you wouldn't miss that one.

[Nwbrewer]

Not to mention having stage/deco bottles on the left side.

Richard, Brian, you guys are getting slow, figured you wouldn't miss that one.

I thought the stage/deco bottle went on the left because the canlight was on the right? In other words the canlight placement is responsible for the deco bottle placement, not the other way around.

[CaptnJack]

Not to mention having stage/deco bottles on the left side.

Richard, Brian, you guys are getting slow, figured you wouldn't miss that one.

I thought the stage/deco bottle went on the left because the canlight was on the right? In other words the canlight placement is responsible for the deco bottle placement, not the other way around.

They are on the left because the long hose is on the right (post) moreso than anything to do with the can light. Leaving one side "clean" (the right) has proven to be optimal.

Realize that this all evolved from a Xmas tree deal with deco cylinders on both sides, "right hand rich", a can light on the butt, etc etc towards scootering in a cave in a cleaner configuration.

[BDub]

Not to mention having stage/deco bottles on the left side.

Richard, Brian, you guys are getting slow, figured you wouldn't miss that one.

I thought the stage/deco bottle went on the left because the canlight was on the right? In other words the canlight placement is responsible for the deco bottle placement, not the other way around.

When I was creating the UTD Stage/Deco Bottle curriculum I typed this up, but never got around to posting it. Hope that helps with regards to stage/deco bottles.

Matt, this is getting a little off topic. If you want to split this, let me know (then, tell me how to do it)

[spatman]

When I was creating the UTD Stage/Deco Bottle curriculum I typed this up, but never got around to posting it. Hope that helps with regards to stage/deco bottles.

Matt, this is getting a little off topic. If you want to split this, let me know (then, tell me how to do it)

nice write up, brian. thanks for the link.

no need to split it, since i did ask about the evolution, but if you think it would be best to do so, PM me and i'll tell you how.

[ljjames]

no one has mentioned the 'ditch-able weight' reason. Probably cause there are not so many SLA canisters these days, but there was a time when the light was considered part of your ditch-able weight.

The reasons 'why' are not nearly as compelling as the reasons why not.

1) butt mount - will likely mess with trim to some degree, sitting on your light canister/switch/cords with dubs = not good for it.
2) tank mount, side - hard to ditch in case of flood, makes you wider, way out from center so magnifies side to side balance
3) Tank mount, center - hard to ditch in case of flood, makes you higher profile, causes 'pitching' problems as you tilt side to side (similar to the single tank feeling)

This is all from the NSS Cave Diving Manual c 1992

what they say about waist mounting: Keep in mind that in 1992 the canisters were HUGE SLA packs, about half the size of a stage bottle.

The pictures show proper placement on the right side

<quote>

Waist mounting - via webbing on the canister placed of the waist belt of the harness, and a quick release buckle to wedge the canister against the backplate - is also very popular, especially with new cave divers. The attachment method is quick and easy. Adjustments are are typically minor; you can only adjust the up/down placement of the canister or rearrange the location of accessories - spare lights, reels, for example - drawbacks of waist mounting may include an excessive tendency to roll, the inclination to clutter attachment points on the other side of your body to overcome trim problems, which may be encountered, and a potential inaccessibility of other attachment points near the canister (although experienced waist mounters would successfully argue that this is not much of a factor).

</end quote>

what can be inferred here is that if your belt buckle is on your left waist strap, (and you are putting a second buckle to hold light canister in place) that you would not be putting your canister on the left side. Every picture in the "equipment configuration" chapter shows the buckle for your waist strap on the left side (right side is the bite of the belt) All pictures with lights (like, all of them since this is cave diving) show the goodman handle in the left hand.

The NSS manual is still a very good resource despite its age.

[CaptnJack]

no one has mentioned the 'ditch-able weight' reason. Probably cause there are not so many SLA canisters these days

I have 2 SLA cans now and I'm looking for another one, back to the future baby!!

yes they are big & heavy but its just lead that I would need to wear anyway. batteries are cheap, last a long time, and aren't finicky about charging.

[spatman]

no one has mentioned the 'ditch-able weight' reason. Probably cause there are not so many SLA canisters these days

I have 2 SLA cans now and I'm looking for another one, back to the future baby!!

yes they are big & heavy but its just lead that I would need to wear anyway. batteries are cheap, last a long time, and aren't finicky about charging.

my 35w canister is pretty big and heavy. probably not like the SLAs, but enough to be annoying at times....

[ljjames]

LOL

ya, thats why I said "not so many" :P My Euro dive buddies all wear SLA, so I should have said "in the USA".

I was looking at a picture of one of the more petite women who used to dive with the WKPP back in the 90s, and noted that she had not one but TWO primary lights and canisters on her belt. I'll never whine about wearing my 13.5 and 9 NiMH packs at same time for video, primary and suit heater again

no one has mentioned the 'ditch-able weight' reason. Probably cause there are not so many SLA canisters these days

I have 2 SLA cans now and I'm looking for another one, back to the future baby!!

yes they are big & heavy but its just lead that I would need to wear anyway. batteries are cheap, last a long time, and aren't finicky about charging.

[CaptnJack]

no one has mentioned the 'ditch-able weight' reason. Probably cause there are not so many SLA canisters these days

I have 2 SLA cans now and I'm looking for another one, back to the future baby!!

yes they are big & heavy but its just lead that I would need to wear anyway. batteries are cheap, last a long time, and aren't finicky about charging.

my 35w canister is pretty big and heavy. probably not like the SLAs, but enough to be annoying at times....

about 1/2 the size of a 14amp SLA can (which makes sense since li-ions are about 4x the energy density of SLAs but you've got a big ballast in the can too.

anywho, a big chunk of all this comes down to having a non-stuffed long hose on the post that can't roll off. the rest of the configuration is built around that foundation.

[ljjames]

Perhaps the tucking is the 'reason' in GUE/etc... although in my class, they didn't specifically state that (and i was taking DIRF with a 50 dive new to DIR who asked all those questions) But it is not mentioned _anywhere_ as the foundation in the 'old' literature. (and yes, donating the primary AND long hoses are covered) In fact, they state that the long hose should be worn on the outside of everything so as to have nothing to catch on when being deployed. "you simply bow your head to allow the long hose to deploy and makes it's full length available to your buddy" (again, quote from NSS cave diving manual)

I'm not saying that the NSS book isn't dated, etc... but the question was to origin of the canister on the right side. Looking back at the history books, (and i'm looking at other sources too) nothing yet bout hooking the long hose under the canister.

hooking under the canister is perhaps part of the evolution

[CaptnJack]

Perhaps the tucking is the 'reason' in GUE/etc... although in my class, they didn't specifically state that (and i was taking DIRF with a 50 dive new to DIR who asked all those questions) But it is not mentioned _anywhere_ as the foundation in the 'old' literature. (and yes, donating the primary AND long hoses are covered) In fact, they state that the long hose should be worn on the outside of everything so as to have nothing to catch on when being deployed. "you simply bow your head to allow the long hose to deploy and makes it's full length available to your buddy" (again, quote from NSS cave diving manual)

I'm not saying that the NSS book isn't dated, etc... but the question was to origin of the canister on the right side. Looking back at the history books, (and i'm looking at other sources too) nothing yet bout hooking the long hose under the canister.

hooking under the canister is perhaps part of the evolution

I don't have those books... Do they talk about which post to put the long on? (left vs right?) Is that an assumed thing or??

Its always been my understanding that the long hose <must> go on the right post
Long hose <must> be breathed to be able to donate from your mouth
Need a place to wrap/hook the long hose so the canister was conveniently commandeered for that job.

Cave divers have been using canister lights from at least the beginnings of the long hose era (60s), certainly from before the creation of the dual outlet manifold. The canister came first, the actual placement was driven by the incorporation of the long hose on the right post.

I don't have any actual text discussing this, but its what I have gleaned from Caverns Measureless to Man and his eveloving gear configuration.

[ljjames]

they indeed cover roll offs and breathing off right post, and donating the known to be working reg. if you are breathing the long hose to donate, then you have long hose on right. the pictures show it that way, but i am not sure if it is explicitly stated. the style of the book is to give you ways you'll see it done, the whys, the pros and cons, and let you (or more likely your instructor) decide. the drawings are all HOG looking

[airsix]

From the training and equipment aspects, if you start with the end in mind and work down, you'll never have to change or relearn anything. You're simply adding to the foundation you've already built. Likewise, you don't have to change gear configurations for rec dives to tech dives to cave dives.

I used to think this was a non-issue and that I should just do what works best for ME under present circumstances and then change later if/as needed. I was wrong. There really is something to what Brian is saying here. The foundation method is much easier. I'm done with DWW because it only works until you add something new. Then you have to come up with an all new DWW, which feels like taking steps backward. I made it work for a while but found it to be a pretty inefficient way to progress.

"Not blinding your buddy when you donate the long hose" is a massively overhyped internet reason to <only> have the light in the left hand.

I agree. Light-in-left is no guarantee. You never know when someone might do something crazy like a left-handed long-hose donation. I hear that's happened before.

[Nwbrewer]

"Not blinding your buddy when you donate the long hose" is a massively overhyped internet reason to <only> have the light in the left hand.

I agree. Light-in-left is no guarantee. You never know when someone might do something crazy like a left-handed long-hose donation. I hear that's happened before.

Shhhh! In addition to donating left handed, don't forget that you can also dump your BC with your right hand while controlling a maskless diver with your left. I don't recommend it but it can be done.

[airsix]

I'm still waiting for my UTD Ambidextrous Seeing-Eye-Dog-Diver card.