Cave Dive Almost Ends In Tragedy

Tangfish · Post by **Tangfish** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 11:35 am

Mike has recently been exploring a cave in Malaysia and was sitting through his deco, having conducted a deep dive. Mike got bored and decided to get some food and drink from a habitat he had placed in the cave, but as the vis was so bad he got lost, and ended up lost for a while in the cave, having lost a fin, run out of inflation gas, and very low on O2. Incredibly this was all at 3 mtrs depth with his ’support’ team sat on the bank completely unaware of his situation.

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Joshua Smith · Post by **Joshua Smith** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:06 pm

Hmmm- the link seems to be to a different story about a diver almost getting swept out to sea...pretty good read, but I'd like to read the cave diver story, too!

lamont · Post by **lamont** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:17 pm

the write up is here:

http://drmike.smugmug.com/gallery/1777060

other screw up stories by the same guy:

http://drmike.smugmug.com/Screw%20up%20stories/207736

he was cave certified only a year ago.

here's also a message that he posted on gavinscooters:

Hi Simon,

Thanks for your email - I appreciate your point.

I don't want to get into having to defend myself and my experience level - there's no point we are all learning and gaining experience and everything is relative. Nobody knows better than me that I'm an ass for making these mistakes.

I take your point that I haven't been cave diving for long but how much and what type of cave diving have I been doing in the last 12 months compared to most cave divers over several years? Other than my dives in Florida its been 100% virgin cave, mostly all deep in low/no viz, remote sites and often with little/no support. Being semi retired I'm on cave or wreck expeditions every month (check out the dates on my website for some of my cave and wreck expeditions) As you will partly see I came to cave diving after a wealth of wreck diving so I bring that experience with me.

As I'm sure you are aware virgin, deep, cave exploration is not anything at all like doing great viz large lined tourist caves (as some cave divers only ever do for years making them in comparison feel far more experienced) when in fact they are really only ever running jumps.

I think you can/do learn more doing one virgin cave exploration dive (especially a deep one) than you can doing dozens of easy cave dives just running jumps and learning, experiencing, nothing new (because its just a repeat each time no new experiences)

However I understand your point, we are all learning, developing experience. How far we stretch ourselves depends on how we feel about our abilities. I can only say that so far I have not felt that I have attempted a dive beyond my training or abilities (I still don't) - I would never attempt such a dive. I didn't wake up one day and just start doing 200m cave dives there has been a great deal of build up to this point diving deep wreck, getting cave training and diving increasingly deeper/challenging caves (albeit in a very short period of time) Having said that CLEARLY based on this incident I have to sort my shit out.

To be honest my biggest problem I think is my diving experience has made me very (too) comfortable in the water (as is evident by the fact I can control myself when the shit really hits the fan) and therein lies my biggest problem - complacency. If I spent another 5 years diving cave I cant see how (other than increasing the instictive reactions) that would make me anymore comfortable in a cave. My problem on this dive as it has been on wreck dives Ive screwed up and Ive reported on in the past, is not lack of training or knowledge it is complacency and being too comfortable. I needed a shock to break me out of it - I got one.

Would I gain from more experience? - sure wouldn't we all. Have I been too deep too soon? Possibly, but I do not believe so. The reason I don't believe so is that (views on DIR or rebreathers aside) when I look at what mistakes I made on the dive they are not related at all to depth, lack of knowledge or training -they could just as easily have happened diving a shallow cave. I think my main problem is complacency has krept in (to both my cave and wreck diving) - and without a shock, like this dive, that is a risk that is more likely to increase with experience not decrease.

Just for info, maybe I really do need to correct a few ideas about this dive that somepeople may have perhaps incorrectly assumed based on my poor reporting and give a better description. Please excuse the bandwidth if its of no interest:-

xxx

The habitat (small upturned bucket) was off a line from the main line. There was a line to the surface (SMB) from the habitat (I didn't run a line out to the edge of the head pool for fear of local village kids playing with it]. I determined that the burn time of my HID light was adequate to bring me to the light zone. I naturally had sufficient back up lights. My trim weights were adjusted to give me horizontal trim in the cave. Due to the extreme depth I was running my O2 and dil from both on-board and off-board tanks (to get the gas volumes needed) same true of inflation gas. I carried and had staged on the line full OC bailout. I also had whips on all tanks so I could use them as inflation gas if needed. As pointed out already by George one mistake was I dropped all the tanks off (other than one mix tank) at the habitat (when in the bad viz I should have kept them on me) and then I ran the rebreather off what was left in the on-boards assuming I could go the 10 feet or so to the habitat from where I would be decoing if I ran low on gas and collect/plug in my reserves. I dropped the tanks because I wanted to unburden myself after dragging them all the way through the cave after determining that I had enough in the onboards to complete deco. At the habitat, staged on the line all through the cave and carried was sufficient bailout OC gas to turn the dive and complete deco all on OC. Discussions with the rebreather manufacturer and other users suggested the scrubber would be good for 8 hours (the run dive time was to be just under 8 hours and I had plenty of 80% OC gas (at the habitat) if needed to switch)

Primary mistake was I left the habitat and swam the 10 feet perpendicular from it to the tree that I knew was there and I could lay on during deco and read. I didn't put a line between the two before the dive (because we had good viz and no idea reason to believe it would turn to shit during the dive) I didn't put a line in when I swam over because I'm a damn idiot. This was what I regard as my Primary mistake.

When I tried to return to the habitat I couldn't find it (despite it being only 10 feet away from and perpendicular to the tree I was decoing on. The only reason I can come up with as to why I didn't use a line to jump that 10 feet was that I was far to relaxed and confident that Id be able to find it. Even before I started cave diving I had become far-far too accustomed to working in zero viz and far too complacent in that condition. I basically messed up being too lazy to run a line 10 feet. Just after I lost access to the habitat and the staged gas that was there I lost my fin (accident) and then ran low on inflation. At this point I decided it was safer to stay put against the side of the headpool than to start a search for the habitat (with one fin, low inflation) - as I calculated I would have enough gas reserves in the on-boards and I was running a quite conservative deco schedule.

Moving around the bank was a stupid mistake. It just didn't cross my mind that there would be an overhead that shallow. I didn't make allowances gas wise/scrubber wise for getting into the overhead during ascent/entangled and the time spent getting out so my reserves ran low.

We can debate on the fact I was not diving DIR that I was on my own, that I was diving a rebreather etc etc but basically, in my mind at least, my main mistake was not having a line that 10 feet from the deco tree to the habitat. Had I had one it would have been an uneventful dive.

The main thing I take from this dive is I have to lose the complacency. I had grown too relaxed too comfortable - even to the extent of not carrying out the very basics (running a line thet short distance in low viz) It has been a good wake up call for me that (this time) hopefully I will not forget.

Cheers
Dr Mike Gadd

(personally I'm not impressed with the lessons that he's drawing...)

Sounder · Post by **Sounder** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 1:09 pm

I don't know anything about cave or wreck diving, but this story reminds me of something Grateful Diver shared with us - that dive accidents often happen after a series of bad choices beginning in the parking lot (pre-dive). He explained it as a "chain" and that at any point if one was to break the link, the accident wouldn't have happened or could have been prevented.

To my ignorant ears, it sounds like there were several places in which he could have "broken the chain" anywhere from NOT diving solo to running the "10' line" he kept talking about wishing he'd done.

I don't know much about it, but cave diving creeps me out.

dsteding · Post by **dsteding** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 1:10 pm

Wow, what is the over/under on this guy running out of luck?

Sounder · Post by **Sounder** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 1:11 pm

No kidding! I don't wish harm on anyone, but there's only so many near-misses one can have.

dsteding · Post by **dsteding** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 1:18 pm

I sure wouldn't wish harm on the guy either.

Bob's teachings were also running through my head as I read this guy's stories. One bad decision after another, any one of which would have broken the chain . . .

These stories remind me of the bar exam. In Washington, the bar exam is a series of short hypotheticals, and the game is to spot as many issues as possible and then identify the law that applies to the issue. These articles should be required reading for any newer diver, with the goal of highlighting mistakes and opportunities to break the chain that will lead to an accident . . .

Lamont, his response that you posted from the gavinscooter list is equally disturbing. His problem isn't complacency, it is a lack of good training and basic skills. Note that all of his issues in wrecks were compounded by silting the wreck out, and probably wouldn't have happened with good training, sufficient skills, and a good team to work with.

Tangfish · Post by **Tangfish** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 1:55 pm

Nailer99 wrote:Hmmm- the link seems to be to a different story about a diver almost getting swept out to sea...pretty good read, but I'd like to read the cave diver story, too!

Oops, sorry. Link fixed.

lamont · Post by **lamont** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 3:45 pm

Yeah, the post I quoted above was in response to one from Simon which ended:

I have had a bet on about you for the last 6 months or so, and
everything I see tells me that you are going to win it for me.

Simon Richards

I had read Dr. Mike's stuff before on TDS and thought he was a pretty knowledgable guy and such. Then he had the incident in the ship around the same time as I was thinking about taking a wreck workshop and he scared the poop out of me, but I read that write up just trying to learn from his mistake and figuring he got bit by "complacency kills" and such. Now he's had a few more incidents like that one, and that last defense of his diving style on gavinscooters really just blew me away. The caves and the wrecks are trying to talk to him and tell him to slow down, and he's not really listening. Its too bad it gets lost in all the DIR vs. Rebreather junk, because the problems highlighted in this incident really don't require any particular religion to see. Flopping around without a fin, without a guideline, with limited gas (because you lost track of a cylinder you were trailing around behind you) and stumbling into a solid overhead is symptomatic of inexperience no matter how many feet of deep virgin cave he's surveyed already...

dsteding · Post by **dsteding** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 5:22 pm

lamont wrote:Its too bad it gets lost in all the DIR vs. Rebreather junk, because the problems highlighted in this incident really don't require any particular religion to see. Flopping around without a fin, without a guideline, with limited gas (because you lost track of a cylinder you were trailing around behind you) and stumbling into a solid overhead is symptomatic of inexperience no matter how many feet of deep virgin cave he's surveyed already...

Well said Lamont-this isn't a DIR versus rebreather issue, it is a basic prudence in diving issue. One that all of us should have learned in OW.

What does concern me is the comfort that the rebreather provides, he'll get bit hard if that thing craps the bed when he's worked himself into one of these situations.

I don't think we should derive comfort from our experience and bottom time-in his case he shouldn't point to virgin caves as evidence of his skills. Rather, if anything our experiences underwater should make us realize how very vunerable we can be. That should lead to sharpening of skills . . . which may make us understand our limitations better, and even expand those limitations . . . but the worst product of increased bottom time to me would be an increase in complacency . . .

Funny, because I too have thought he has had some good posts and things to offer on TDS.

Joshua Smith · Post by **Joshua Smith** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 9:17 pm

Yeah- I'm far, far away from being anything like a tech/ cave/ wreck penetration diver, but this guy needs a reality check- he's showing a kind of false humility by posting this stuff- and I don't think he's being realistic about his "lessons learned." Honestly, he seems downright determined to kill himself.

sparky · Post by **sparky** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 10:38 pm

Is it just me? Or does this clown talk in circles? First he says "I know what I'm doing" then a line or two later he claims
"I need more experience and training."
Then" I know what I am doing I have just made so many dives I have gotten complacent."

I tried to read his story all the way through but he makes me dizzy.
I wonder if that is what happened to him on his dive he was swimming along and going over in his mind what he would say in his dive report and got dizzy.

I would buy that I know his dive report makes me dizzy

You know what is the scariest part of this is?
This guy will probably never hurt or even kill him self , what is much more likely is he will meet a young up and coming cave or wreck diver that thinks because this guy has made so many dangerous dives like this and survived that he would be a good person to learn from.

That is more then likely the diver that will be hurt or worse

Sparky

Joshua Smith · Post by **Joshua Smith** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 10:42 pm

sparky wrote:Is it just me? Or does this clown talk in circles? First he says "I know what I'm doing" then a line or two later he claims
"I need more experience and training."
Then" I know what I am doing I have just made so many dives I have gotten complacent."

I tried to read his story all the way through but he makes me dizzy.
I wonder if that is what happened to him on his dive he was swimming along and going over in his mind what he would say in his dive report and got dizzy.

I would buy that I know his dive report makes me dizzy

You know what is the scariest part of this is?
This guy will probably never hurt or even kill him self , what is much more likely is he will meet a young up and coming cave or wreck diver that thinks because this guy has made so many dangerous dives like this and survived that he would be a good person to learn from.

That is more then likely the diver that will be hurt or worse

Sparky

Wow. Sparky Nailed it. Good call, man! That was really insightfull.

diver-dad · Post by **diver-dad** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 11:41 pm

sparky wrote: This guy will probably never hurt or even kill him self , what is much more likely is he will meet a young up and coming cave or wreck diver that thinks because this guy has made so many dangerous dives like this and survived that he would be a good person to learn from.

That is more then likely the diver that will be hurt or worse

Nailer's right - Sparky's got it right on the money. I pray that never comes to pass.

(I'd never want to dive with this guy, or even in the same neighborhood - he's just plain dangerous.)

thelawgoddess · Post by **thelawgoddess** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 8:46 am

yep ... i think complacency comes more from the ego than anything else.

diver-dad · Post by **diver-dad** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 2:42 pm

One day, his luck will run out. Then we'll be reading about his last misadventure. (Perhaps it may even make the Darwin Awards.)

One of the problems with jokers like this is that their reckless abandon can translate into needless restrictions, rules, regulations, and laws crafted by good intentioned, but unknowing politicians.

Examples abound.